Valve Trombone

Discussion in 'Trumpet Discussion' started by surfingmusicman, Dec 28, 2011.

  1. surfingmusicman

    surfingmusicman New Friend

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    Nov 17, 2011
    I have a really time-consuming job that doesn't leave much time for practicing. If I can get seven hours in a week I'm pretty dang happy about it. I don't want to take more time than is necessary to get up to speed on bone, and am not going to try to free lance with it. I want it for my own recordings and as a short once-in-awhile switch out for my regular rock/funk/jazz/reggae gigs.

    I appreciate everyone's comments. For what it's worth, I'm not concerned that someone out there (especially the high school and college guys - no offense :cool: ) might not take me seriously as a bone player. Truth is, I won't be a serious bone player, so it's really not an issue.

    Anyway, I'm curious if anyone has any comments or experience with the Kanstul 959, Jupiter, or Amatis horns? Or something else that might be better?

    Thanks!
     
  2. Peter McNeill

    Peter McNeill Utimate User

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    Jan 30, 2009
    Melbourne Australia
    Hi Mate,
    I have the Jup Valve Trom and it is out of loan to a "Serious" Slide Trombone Player (Conservatorium Student) at the moment. He is trying to get his mind around the trumpet, so by playing the valve trom he hopes to get the fingerings down faster. It plays well, and the slide section of the normal slide Jup fits on the end. It is a little expensive, and holds it's value well. Kanstul has a good rep, but look at Getzen as well. Amatis I can't help you there.

    I also have a Marching Valve Trom, Baritone Horn and Marching F Horn. They are not as good for intonation, but still good fun. The best thing is they do not take up a lot of room, and are easy to switch around on trumpet, and give different sound dimensions.

    Here's my Jup and Superbone, and a few others.
    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    & Jupiter Slide Trumpet (Soprano Trom)
    [​IMG]
     
  3. Dupac

    Dupac Fortissimo User

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    Aug 19, 2008
    Bordeaux, France.
    I have an Amati valve trombone (short model), that I use only from time to timeā€¦ I enjoy it, but since I'm not really a trombone player, I can't give any serious opinion about it. However you can probably get an opinion by listening to the first disc of Kiku Collins : before becoming a Getzen artist, she played the same Amati than me (way better than me !). Manufacturing is fairly "rustic", but the sound is excellent, IMHO.
    Mikel.
     
    Last edited: Dec 29, 2011
  4. OldSchoolEuph

    OldSchoolEuph Mezzo Forte User

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    Apr 1, 2011
    Michigan
    Just echoing what others have said: be careful about doubling, it really has an impact on the chops.

    As Peter McNeill alluded to, a marching baritone, such as a used Blessing, can be a good, inexpensive alternative if you want to stay in the trumpet mode. No company seems to work at the valve trombone today, but the marching tenors for corps use have been a focus of many companies in recent years. They are decent horns.

    However, stylistically, there simply is no alternative for the slide if you really want to make the most of that voice. . .
     
  5. Local 357

    Local 357 Banned

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    Jul 1, 2011
    Would be doublers: Please read this!


    Good points. The whole trick to doubling is that there are THREE TECHNIQUES to learn:


    1. Trumpet. Most of you already know that one. To some extent anyway.

    2. Trombone. Getting functional. "Survival chops" i like to call it.

    3. Switching back and forth "on the fly".


    I just came out of a three hour R & B rehearsal. Spending about 1/3rd the time on slide trombone. Despite playing a good forte + volume on these tunes (on trombone) I was yet able to convincingly pull off some really hard/high trumpet charts. Including "You're Still A Young Man" and other demanding tower and james brown charts. I can thus assure you that Number #3 above is a very PRACTICE DEPENDENT technique.

    Most trumpet players who double on low brass give up when they find the initial conflict upon going back on their main horn. Feeling like "leather lips" lol... Their mistake wasn't that they doubled but that they didn't gradually work into the switch.


    I can play the trombone ten miles past the point when I can not get a musical tone out of the trumpet. And I have good endurance on the trumpet. So the point is to cool it at first while learning to double.

    later you'll likely find that by playing trombone your net worth as a brass musician increases 200%
     
    Last edited: Dec 30, 2011
  6. EdMann

    EdMann Mezzo Forte User

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    Sep 20, 2007
    Los Angeles
    I've enjoyed my Olds Special slide bone for about 18 months now, and I play it around 5 times a week, usually in the morning. Purely recreational, and I haven't seen that it hurts or helps my trpt skills at all. It's just what it is, a trombone. I've practically ignored bass clef playing and work strictly off Bb parts. Only so much time in the day, so my value as a bone for hire is pretty nil! As for the Jupiter valve, fine, but intonation is suspect. I enjoyed trying the Kanstuls and they seemed to throw out a better sound. Valved bone has less resistance in the system typically than the slide, so I learned my positions and had at it. Great fun.

    If I have any value out there, it's on the trpt but I can certainly see what developed skills on doubling to can provide. Dave Richards out of No. Texas State, who's now here in LA, is pretty much booked playing both instruments, and he doubles exceedingly well. A lot of the younger cats I meet here get a name specializing, i.e. jazz chops, section work, lead, but Dave is doing all chairs in the backrow and bone work, so he does quite well after only a couple/three years in town.

    Enjoy your search!

    ed
     
  7. Brad-K

    Brad-K Piano User

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    Jun 18, 2011
    SHAME SHAME ON YOU! YOU GOTTA PLAY THAT F CLEF!!!!!! (insert evil-meanie smiley here)
     
  8. Ed Lee

    Ed Lee Utimate User

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    Jackson NC
    I'll say this about a slide trombone, they are the only brass instrument on which one can play a perfect slur and really whoop! However, I'm about to retire my King tenor T-bone, whereas my Conn Artist euphonium now does most of what I want to do with more extended range than the T-bone, the two overlapping.
     
  9. Ed Lee

    Ed Lee Utimate User

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    Aug 16, 2009
    Jackson NC
    The tenor T-bone is a Bb instrument in both G (treble) & F (bass) clefs. Methinks your problem is that you don't read the bass clef well or can't lip the T-bone that low.

    With the F clef, ascending and alternating line and space, the notes are GABCDEFGA. Add a BCD and the next rising note is E or the bottom line of the G clef. My point being that with a tuner to aid you a Bb is a Bb wherever it is placed, be it in the treble or bass clef or in between them or otherwise within the range of any instrument. Likewise other notes.

    The bass trumpet, trombone, baritone, and euphonium all use the same mpc. I prefer a 6.5 AL in lieu of a 12C. I suppose it would be possible to acquire a trumpet rim/cup with a trombone etc. shank, but I haven't the need, (or want to evaluate such). I make do!
     
  10. EdMann

    EdMann Mezzo Forte User

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    Sep 20, 2007
    Los Angeles
    I don't have a problem. Thank you for your attention to this pressing matter...
     

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