What are cheaters?

Discussion in 'Trumpet Discussion' started by Blazing Asian, Jan 9, 2007.

  1. Tootsall

    Tootsall Fortissimo User

    Oct 25, 2003
    Yee HAW!
    "Absolutely critical to your continued improvement"
  2. Dale Proctor

    Dale Proctor Utimate User

    Jul 20, 2006
    Heart of Dixie
    Here's an interesting cheater story. I was asked to sub on lead book for a local big band gig. I hadn't played that stuff in about a year, and decided to set up with just a Schilke 13A4a (my cheater) for my trumpet, and my flugelhorn. Well, everyone was dancing pretty good, and the bandleader decided to push the first break back about 45 minutes, so we did a 1 3/4 hour first set. I usually play on a 3C and I really wished I had it about an hour into the gig. My lip was going fast, and the only relief I could get was on the flugel. At break I went to the room where we left our cases and got the 3C. Much better after that. The smaller mouthpiece was actually more tiring to play than the 3C! I learned that a cheater is OK to use for an occasional upper range boost, but it's better to stick with your normal mouthpiece for the majority of playing.
  3. rowuk

    rowuk Moderator Staff Member

    Jun 18, 2006
    The problem with a 13 or 14A4A "cheater" is that the shallower cup does not give your lips any room to swell. Once your chops start to plug up the mouthpiece, you are in trouble. A better "cheater" for a 3C player would be a 10 1/2C or comparable. At least there is some room for swelling!
  4. Dale Proctor

    Dale Proctor Utimate User

    Jul 20, 2006
    Heart of Dixie
    Very true - that's exactly what happened, and that's why I could play the flugel better at the end of the "cheater set". I've found that if you're going to "cheat", the better way to go is a smaller diameter cup opening with a normal cup depth. A wider cup opening coupled with shallow cup depth is a recipe for bottoming out when tired. Of course, this varies from player to player, but I've found the 10 1/2C to be a very good mouthpiece for me in certain situations.
  5. Richard Oliver

    Richard Oliver Forte User

    Jul 18, 2006
    Casper, WY
    I'm using a Schilke 9 these days, and a Wick 4 on cornet. By accident, I discovered what so many of you already know.

    When I began playing again last February, I owned only my old Schilke 14. It's close to 30 years old now.

    I read Jens Lindemann's essay on mouthpieces and decided to downsize.

    I looked at the numbers and bought a Vacchiano 4C. Seemed middle of the road. Well, I didn't know the Vacchiano had a V'ish cup. Really zipped up the old Selmer some which it didn't really need in the first place.

    Bought the Schilke 9 recently and the sound is more to what I am accoustomed and prefer. Both the Vacchiano and Schilke are very close in diameter.

    Should I find myself in a position, unlikely as it may be, where I need ciltius, altius, fortius (yes, the "altius" doesn't really apply in this case, but I couldn't resist), the Vacchiano 4C, I anticipate working very well.

    So I stumbled into discovering how a V'ish "C" cup can affect tone. Also, the Vacchiano still has plenty of room in the cup. It is in no wise "dinky."

    I knew this already but in regards to a deeper cup not a moderate cup depth. Also, to my eye, the Vacchiano has a slightly smaller throat.


    Richard Oliver
    Last edited: Jan 10, 2007

Share This Page