When is a Meter Real: Tom Stevens Master Class

Discussion in 'Trumpet Discussion' started by Richard Oliver, Mar 30, 2014.

  1. Vulgano Brother

    Vulgano Brother Moderator Staff Member

    Age:
    60
    12,458
    7,035
    Mar 23, 2006
    Parts Unknown
    The downbeat came early after the sixteenth note (that's how I hear it, but it could be an eighth in 3/2--and would explain the 12th note reference). Put another way, the downbeat was rushed, or the sixteenth (or eighth) was played too short. The Concone I practiced were arranged by Rochut for trombone, so learned bass clef and how to play lyrically with rhythmic precision all at the same time. When playing under Bruce Ferden, he would at times ask us to "place" the notes. At other times he would let us play a bit more sloppily as long as things were together. An example of "sloppy" playing in 33 (pity Glenn Ferris, the trombone player!):

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aUYtWvavvYg

    (In case you are wondering, Bulgarian Bulge is subdivided 2 2 2 2 3 2 2 2 2 3 2 3 2 2)
     
  2. Sethoflagos

    Sethoflagos Utimate User

    5,331
    4,731
    Aug 7, 2013
    Lagos, Nigeria
    During sight-reading I found changes of metre the most difficult thing to handle. Much more so than key signatures. A change of key gives you all the information you need to know up front. A new metrical rhythm though has to be 'felt' and to a certain extent you don't feel it until you're actually playing it.

    6/4 was a real bugbear for me, particularly since it isn't used consistently. Do you treat it as simple time stressing beats 1-3-5; or compound stressing 1 and 4; or follow an irregular stress pattern dictated by the flow and cadences of the melody (as in the Promenade from Pictures at an Exhibition)?

    The other factor is tempo. At a ridiculous extreme, how would you handle a switch from say 5/4 to 6/8? Does crotchet become quaver or dotted crotchet? I guess it's the latter, but you have to think about it.
     
  3. Cornyandy

    Cornyandy Fortissimo User

    3,139
    1,603
    Jan 9, 2010
    East Yorkshire
    I'll have a look later in the day, promise.
     
  4. stumac

    stumac Fortissimo User

    2,776
    1,904
    Oct 19, 2008
    Flinders Vic Australia
    In the piece I referred to earlier there is a section of several bars of 4/4, several bars of 3/4 and back to 4/4 where we play 1/8 notes at the same pitch, I have not thought before, the 4/4 play the beats strong, weak, medium, weak and the 3/4 strong, weak, weak, gives the sound of the train going over the joints in the rails.

    Aint music great.

    Regards, Stuart.
     
  5. Vulgano Brother

    Vulgano Brother Moderator Staff Member

    Age:
    60
    12,458
    7,035
    Mar 23, 2006
    Parts Unknown
    Quaver = quaver unless above the staff (usually in parenthesis) you see something like minum = dotted minum, most common in Renaissance music. For the 5/4 6/8 example think quavers:3+2+3+3. Practice counting "1,2,3,1,2,1,2,3,1,2,3.... until you can tart tapping your foot on the one's. Much better exercise in a plane or train than a pencil or P.E.T.E., in my opinion.
     
  6. Hugh Anderson

    Hugh Anderson Pianissimo User

    82
    12
    Sep 18, 2011
    It is making the note after the dotted note too short.
     
  7. Sethoflagos

    Sethoflagos Utimate User

    5,331
    4,731
    Aug 7, 2013
    Lagos, Nigeria
    I can see what you say working for 5/8 to 6/8, VB. I see 5/4 to 6/8 going 1-and 2-and 3-and 4-and 5-and: 1-and-a 2-and-a: 1-and-a 2-and-a.
     
  8. Vulgano Brother

    Vulgano Brother Moderator Staff Member

    Age:
    60
    12,458
    7,035
    Mar 23, 2006
    Parts Unknown
    I'd still go with the smallest denominator. I don't want Tommy Stevens boxing my ears.
     
  9. Sethoflagos

    Sethoflagos Utimate User

    5,331
    4,731
    Aug 7, 2013
    Lagos, Nigeria
    Just got to hymn 337 in the 1877 Hymns Ancient and Modern, and found it's in a time signature of 3/1. Had to run through that a couple of times before I got the hang of it. Not often you come across upbeat semibreves (whole notes).

    ...or would you still be tapping out the quavers, VB? ;-)
     
  10. Vulgano Brother

    Vulgano Brother Moderator Staff Member

    Age:
    60
    12,458
    7,035
    Mar 23, 2006
    Parts Unknown
    Crochets. ;-)
     

Share This Page