Which trumpet comes next?

Discussion in 'Trumpet Discussion' started by trumpettrax, Sep 12, 2006.

  1. trumpettrax

    trumpettrax Piano User

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    My teacher just told me the same thing. He said if I'm going to want to do recitals and wedding gigs then it's time for me to get a piccolo. I'm pretty excited, but now I have to find one I like. I've been reading about them since he told me that and I would like to try a selmer paris (like Maurice Andre played) just because of price. This article I was reading said you can purchase them for about $500-$750.

    trax
     
  2. B15M

    B15M Forte User

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    That sounds a little cheap
     
  3. trumpettrax

    trumpettrax Piano User

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    Sorry, I miss quoted the article. Here it is:

    "The Selmer (Paris) piccs, which once used to dominate the market, are still made. You can get them new from Giardinelli for about $2600 in lacquer, now with a clever thumb trigger that operates a third valve slide, but if I had that much money to spend on one, again, I'd probably choose something different. They are the classic small bore short model, but at the moment the fashion seems to be for the longer, larger bore horns like the Schilke. The Selmer has a clear ringing sound which does remain popular to this day, but the intonation is not as solid as with the Schilke. Nearly all of those classic early Maurice Andre recordings are made on a Selmer. The Selmers, however, are available used in abundance at prices ranging from $700 to $900, and for that money, they are the best horns, new or used, available for most folks and make a great first piccolo. I speak from experience here. Like the Getzens, the horn is also greatly improved by the Blackburn leadpipes. It is startling that such a difference could be made by 3 or 4 inches of brass tubing."


    $700-$900 is the going rate. So, what do you think? Is this really only a beginner piccolo. I would really like to get an instrument (inexpensive) that I really don't need to ever get another one. You know what I mean?

    I really wanted a used Bach, but also according to that same article don't even bother with an older Bach the intonation is too bad. Something like that. Since I'm not a professional I just can't see spending 2500 + and an instrument. My parents bought my Bach back in the '70's used for around $800. That may have been alot then, but....

    Trax
     
  4. rowuk

    rowuk Moderator Staff Member

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    My first picc was a Selmer. Bright sound that did not blend tremendously with the human voice. There are many examples of Bach oratorios and cantatas that sound like trumpet concertos with choir and orchestra accompaniment(also featuring our hero Maurice André).
    The Selmer was easy enough to play, mine was in tune. Osmun also has good leadpipes. This was the horn that set the Picc standard in the early 70s. I think in the 80s Schilke was the standard. The sound concept has matured somewhat and today there are many excellent choices - Stomvi, Yamaha, Scherzer, Thein, Kanstul, Schilke...............
    I personally prefer a rotary picc. I think the sound is better suited for "chamber" music (not as "bright") and that the precision and short throw of the rotary valve makes trills and fast passages cleaner. When you push a piston valve down very slowly while playing, you notice that the sound is not "clear" for over half of the valve throw. A rotary valve is not "clear" only about 1/3rd of the throw. This is the reason that the air flows better and the sound is more precise. I find that legato passages just sound cleaner. Maybe not for everybody, but definitely worth trying out before laying any cash on the counter.
     
  5. B15M

    B15M Forte User

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    I have the exact Selmer set up they are talking about. It was my first picc. I played on it for years before getting the Blackburn lead pipes. They helped a lot. I tried a Shilke and liked it but went with the scherzer for the same reasons as above. I still use the Blackburn pipes in the new picc.

    You can make the Selmer work. When you first start playing it, it will be way out of tune but you will get used to what to do. I stopped playing mine because I got sick of adjusting. The Scherzer just about plays itself.
     
  6. Clarence

    Clarence Mezzo Forte User

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    say mike , just wondering how old are you.
     
  7. Eclipsehornplayer

    Eclipsehornplayer Forte User

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    Just as many have posted here it depends on the direction you take.

    I never had a need for anything other then a Bb since I never did anything after high school.

    Interestingly enough now that I'm back playing again and in different settings I ended up like this over my lifetime:

    1st instrument a Bb Cornet Bundy I think
    Then dad bought me a Bb Trumpet again Bundy
    Then I bought a better Bb King Silverflair 1964 or so
    Then I bought a great Cornet a Getzen Capri
    and then I bought a Bach C

    Now understand than my list spans 27 years so it didn't happen as consecutively as it appears.

    For now I'm done; however I have a feeling that a D/Eb may be in the relative near future.
     
    Last edited: Oct 17, 2006
  8. NickD

    NickD Forte User

    Whoaaa, Mike! ;-)

    Man, Mike! Strong words! ;-)

    I like flugel just to be different. Sure I prefer to play trumpet, but for a diversion, I love my flugel. I sure like the way Clark plays on one.

    I do understand your position, though. I've been listening to a lot of Brian Lynch these days. He plays mostly trumpet, and sounds wonderful - beautiful, clear mellow dark tone. Russ Johnson is that same way.

    Also, flugel has a different acoustic feel, allowing for some different nuances.

    OK, I'm just being a devil's advocate.

    Gotta split.

    Nick
     
  9. gchun

    gchun Piano User

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    OLD Bach Piccolo trumpet

    TrumpetTrax;

    I'll second that opinion about the OLD Bach piccolo. For me (not a trained pic player) that thing was very difficult to play. It was difficult to play soft and delicately on it. Since I'm not a regular pic player, I thought the problem was me (some of it probably was!) But I tried a Kanstul CCT920 and it was like night and day. The Kanstul was very responsive and very fun to play. The Kanstul goes for around $1,600, which is a good deal considering what most good pics go for (usually $2,500 up). I also tried a Yamaha 4 valve Bb (can't remember the model no.) from about 20 years ago that was also very good.

    Now, I've heard good things about the NEW Bach pic. Never tried it, though.

    Garry
     
  10. Hags888

    Hags888 Pianissimo User

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    I'll throw my 2 cents into an already overflowing penny jar.

    -Bb Bach TR300 Student Model (my first horn, bought at age 9 in 5th grade)
    -Bb Bach Strad Model 72, 43 Leadpipe (bought at age 12 in 8th grade)
    -C Bach Strad Model 229 (bought at age 19 as a sophomore in college)
    -Bb/A Yahama 4 valve/short bell piccolo (bought at age 23 in grad school)
    -Eb/D Stomvi Elite (bought at age 24 in grad school)
    -Bb Yahama Flugelhorn Student model (bought at age 26 in grad school)

    As weird as this is going to sound, I still use the same Bb and mouthpiece (Bach 3C) that I've used since 8th grade and it works great. I never had a need for a C until I started playing in orchestra in college. I didn't do much piccolo playing until grad school. But what little I did in undergrad, I did on the school piccolos (they had a couple of old selmers we started on, and then we graduated to new (at the time) Scherzers). I bought an Eb/D in grad school to play the Haydn/Hummel/Neruda as well as some orchestral parts, but I still don't use the horn much. I wish I had spent $2000 on a better piccolo rather than the nice Eb/D, because I use the piccolo at all the time. My Eb/D (while it is certainly a seductive instrument and has been a handy instrument) usually just sits in my case.

    My advice (and it's a little late at this point) is to buy a horn when you need it (ie, the ensembles you're in demands it), or when your teacher says you're ready to learn it.
     

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