Wynton Controversy

Discussion in 'Trumpet Discussion' started by eisprl, Oct 26, 2006.

  1. tpter1

    tpter1 Forte User

    Age:
    53
    2,259
    11
    Jan 12, 2005
    Northern New York
    Ain't he that guy down at the corner store with no teeth?
     
  2. ilikethetrumpet

    ilikethetrumpet Pianissimo User

    Age:
    34
    122
    0
    Sep 10, 2006
    Iowa City, Iowa
    Hey, I like the Al Hirt Haydn for what it is!
     
  3. BAM

    BAM New Friend

    48
    0
    Oct 26, 2003
    I think the main argument here is: what is a "jazz giant"?...This is such a subjective question, that it most certainly will stir up different responses. Bottom line to me is: I have never heard anybody get around the trumpet with as much ease as Wynton, in both classical and jazz. Just watch that UTube video of him playing the Haydn for those of you that aren't convinced of his "classical chops". Jazz wise, check out "Cherokee" from the 7disc set "Live at the Village Vanguard"...maybe you disagree with his style or cleanliness, but the things he is doing as a trumpet player are absolutely mind blowing. I have heard many different criticisms including it's too clean, hasn't created anything new for jazz, too commercialized etc... and my response to this as a trumpet player is that his ability to play the trumpet in either realms of jazz or classical is simply unparalleled EVER. Jazz giant?...i don't know. Incredible trumpet player? (whether you agree with his style or not ((both jazz and classical))) ABSOLUTELY, in fact probably the most talented TRUMPET PLAYER ever IMHO. (and his talent did not only come from being gifted, he works incredibly hard from what I've read about)
     
  4. Liad Bar-EL

    Liad Bar-EL Forte User

    1,151
    2
    Oct 25, 2003
    Jerusalem, Israel

    You really should listen to more classical then BAM.

    Couple of things on this subject of Wynton from another forum:

    http://www.trumpetherald.com/forum/viewtopic.php?topic=16898&forum=3

    What is the problem with Wynton? I feel like pretty much everyone recognizes his trumpet ability but they are hesitant to give him credit for his jazz playing. People say things like"he plays the same thing over again" or "I just don't feel like he is that innovator."

    Wynton plays classical music like a jazzer and jazz like a classical musician.

    It's just that the jazz tradition is about seeking and developing your own voice and living dangerously close to the edge when you play and he has opted for recreating old music and looking backward. Educationally that nurture of old music is very powerful. Artistically it is a guaranteed dead end.

    I also am not enamored with his tone. It seems lifeless.

    technique is one thing
    creativity another.
    listen to MILES DAVIS


    ****************
    For the true test, listen to these sound clips:
    1. Arturo Sandoval playing Mozart Concerto for Trumpet (Adagio) in D Major
    2. Wynton Marsalis playing Mozart Concerto for Trumpet (Adagio) in D Major

    In difference to Wynton, Arturo plays Mozart very clean, light and very clear. No bent notes and much more dynamic in his playing. His trills are not muddled but very clear plus he doesn't use the echo in his recording which for all intense and purposes really has destroyed Wynton's recording. When Arturo comes in on a high note, he doesn't hit you up side of the head with it. You will find other points if you care to listen to them both.

    ****************

    Liad Bar-EL
     
  5. BAM

    BAM New Friend

    48
    0
    Oct 26, 2003
     
  6. wiseone2

    wiseone2 Artitst in Residence Staff Member

    3,418
    373
    Nov 19, 2003
    Brooklyn,NY
    I am speechless:-o
    Bent notes in Mozart. Percussive attacks.....dead tone......
    Wynton should take some lessons and get a Bach. Maybe a few weeks with James Brown will get his soul together. Hey.....maybe we can get Chris Botti on the James Brown gig with Wynton.
    Wynton sucks.
    Who are these Pulitzer people trying to fool? The guys here really know trumpet playing.
    WE ARE THE EXPERTS, RIGHT, LIAD :evil:
    Wilmer
     
  7. tpter1

    tpter1 Forte User

    Age:
    53
    2,259
    11
    Jan 12, 2005
    Northern New York
    Man, do I wish I was a good enough player to make statements like that, Liad. Wynton is gifted. How many players can you list that have Grammys in both the jazz and classical genres? AND a Pulitzer? Dead tone? Who are you referring to again? Man, you must be one heck of a major cat. How many Grammys and Pulitzers do you have?
     
  8. eisprl

    eisprl Mezzo Piano User

    Age:
    35
    602
    1
    Sep 26, 2004
    Halifax, NS CANADA
    He's got a point there. However, I do like listening to Arturo play classical stuff. There is a couple nice pieces he does on the trumpet evolution album.

    (Then again I am a huge Sandoval fan so I'd like anything he does - for the most part)

    Eric
     
  9. B15M

    B15M Forte User

    2,459
    29
    Dec 30, 2003
    Monroe Ct.
    I hear a lot of eco with Andre. Is he hiding something?
     
  10. rowuk

    rowuk Moderator Staff Member

    Age:
    61
    16,609
    7,945
    Jun 18, 2006
    Germany
    I just had to know, so I pulled out the CD. I couldn't wait to discover that Wynton wasn't a jazz giant. I listened to the Leopold Mozart, all I found was inspiration - not much jazz on that track however unless you consider the short chorus at the end of the first movement. I did discover a GIANT concert f sharp in that chorus (4:39 into the track). Hmm, that would be a high G# on a Bb trumpet, now I get it - Wynton must be a lead player and they can't improvise anyway. The chorus on the Haydn first movement really rocks though, maybe not a lead player, Hmm.
    This album seems to have been recorded in 1981 or 82, that would make Wynton 20 or 21. Most of us have not yet graduated from college at that age and most do not have recording contracts with CBS that young. Hmm. Maybe he is a Giant - although this album isn't very jazzy in spite of the walking bass line in the second movement of the Hummel. I guess I need to check out some other CDs, maybe I'll find my proof there.

    By the way WiseOne, Wynton seems to holding a Bach on the back of the CD booklet and the Schilke instruments used on this CD seem to have Bach mouthpieces. I guess only James Brown is left although I know this lady with a Ouija board, so maybe we can get Miles back for a lesson or two.....

    By the way Liad, here is a short excerpt from Wyntonmarsalis.org:
    "In the spring of 2001, United Nations Secretary General Kofi Annan proclaimed Marsalis an international ambassador of goodwill by appointing him a United Nations Messenger of Peace. He also has been awarded the Congressional Horizon Award, the French Grand Prix du Disque, the Louis Armstrong Memorial Medal, the Netherlands’ Edison Award, and the Algur H. Meadows Award for Excellence in the Arts, and has received countless plaques as well as keys to more than 50 cities. He has been inducted into the American Academy of Achievement, and was dubbed an Honorary Dreamer by the “I Have a Dream Foundation.†He also has received a citation from the United States House of Representatives for his outstanding contributions to the arts."
    I guess this makes him at least pretty good!
     

Share This Page