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Discussion in 'Trumpet Discussion' started by Smithi20, Jan 8, 2008.
OK....let's adjust the thread.......Wynton plays Monette which also makes him a target?
When involved in target practice, one should be aware of a phenomenon called "friendly fire". Even in the military this is an effective way to sort out problems otherwise not solvable.
Sorry, I got off-topic yesterday.
Wynton can be as good as Lee Morgan was.
People still love Dizzy Gillespie, probably as much for his personality and showmanship as for his music. Clark Terry shares his wit and warmth when he plays. That is where Wynton lacks. He is articulate, but stuffy in his presentation.
Back in '81 I saw Miles twice: The first time, he was in a great mood, outgoing and friendly, slapping hands with fans. The second time, he never said a word, never faced the crowd. I could practically feel the chill emanating from him. My buddy stood up and shouted; "We don't need you, either, Miles!"
I'm just saying that talent and presentation are two separate things that both require the attention of the performer.
"That is where Wynton lacks. He is articulate, but stuffy in his presentation. "
When did you see him where he was stuffy in his presentation? That hasn't been my experience. My experience is that he is personable with a warm stage presence.
I only saw Wynton,"live", as a Jazz Messenger, so it's been a while. The "stuffy" description may have been the wrong word. I have seen him on tv introducing blues scales to students, for instance, and he was patient and generous with the information. The Lincoln Ctr. broadcasts just seem too clean, formal and somewhat untouchable to the casual listener. I prefer small groups in intimate settings, where the performer and audience share energy. When Wynton comes back to Arizona, I will attend.
"The Lincoln Ctr. broadcasts just seem too clean, formal and somewhat untouchable to the casual listener"
I would suggest that this particular formality has more to do with the venue than with Wynton. I suggest you listen to the Live at the Vanguard cd's to hear how he reacts with an audience when performing with his own group. I think you will find a very engaging performer.
But your post does bring up a phenomenon that I have noticed with Wynton specifically. A lot of people seem to lay a lot of stuff at his feet that they have no first hand experience with. It is bizarre to me.
You talk about his lacking an audience connection as a leader, but you've never experienced it first hand. If it was me, and we were talking about a trumpet player I had never seen live except for a brief clip on TV, I would never presume to post anything about that person's performance style as if I knew what I was talking about. But folks have no problem doing that with Wynton for some reason.
It is easy to post on the internet, especially when the diffamed is not present. We see it everywhere where anonymity rules.
I too am disappointed when confronted by obvious BS. One does not need to like Wyntons playing style, but should at least be honest enough to recognize his value to the cause. Fantasy criticism actually just lets me know where to rate the poster. Hammer56 is entitled to his opinion, the value of that opinion is subject to recall.
I wonder if Hammer56 knows who actually attends the LCJO concerts? Why they also receive national broadcast time? Perhaps they do engage the "casual listener" more than he can imagine. For sure the concerts are attended by a great cross section of the population! I am no died in the wool jazz musician although I do play lead in a couple of bands. Wynton does engage me as much as Dizzy, Chet, Harry or Maynard do. Miles disqualified himself at a concert that I attended in the early 70's by his poor behavior (including some remark on stage about not playing Beethoven because that was dead shit) as well as a second concert a couple of years later. His mark on jazz development is substantial, his bad manners are my enduring first hand impression.
I met him many years ago outside Lincoln Center on the way to see him perform at the Mostly Mozart Festival. He was performing a classical concert with the soprano Frederica von Stade. I got his autograph and he stopped and chatted with me for a few moments. He was very friendly and outgoing. This was BEFORE his performance (which by the way was outstanding.)
Walking down Seventh Avenue with Wynton quite a few years ago, long before he was WYNTON MARSALIS, a very pretty young lady stopped us. She stared at Wynton and said,"You're somebody." She shook her head,"Who are you?"
This was before he was a household name. We loao.
I've seen Wynton Marsalis twice with the LCJO. I got more than my money's worth. He is so talented and he leads a group of talented individuals. Jazz is not a big revenue generator and without someone like Wynton, I don't know how the LCJO could survive.