rjzeller

Wow...Lara...nicely said! Very astute and well put. I guess you deserve a hug, too!

Maybe LP can give you one, he seems to have a lot of anger anway. A hug might do him well...

__________________
There are 10 kinds of people in the world: Those who understand binary and those who do not.

silverstar

Thanks.

Lara

__________________
email: Lara.Shema@gmail.com
*****************************************
*insert witty comment here*

Bugler997

My ideals are most similar to those of republicans/conservatives.

Anyway,

RJ, no reason to say someone "[has] a lot of anger," just because he is defending himself in a fight you started.

I also liked the part where you said it "doesn't matter what Lara is, ...[nor] what Kelly is." However, for some reason it seems to matter what LP is.

I'm all for voting whoever you support, rather than punish members of a certain party. Actually, I just wish political parties would disappear, the candidates would be excellent if that happened.

__________________
Yamaha Xeno Bb (YTR-8335GS) // Monette B2
Yamaha Xeno C (YTR-8445S) // Monette C2

brian moon

Brianwashed is more accurate most of the time. Darwinism is forced on you from day one even though it is a religion, not science.

__________________
Revelation 3:20

rjzeller

Well bugler, I'll concede -- it was unfair for me to say he was angry. Just a little, meritless, fun. I was wrong to imply as much and I do apologize (to you, LP). But as for who started the "fight", I do recall that I started the thread and LP later came along an replied in a matter that was not only directly in opposition to my viewpoint, but which also firmly illustrated the exact problem I was pointing to. I didn't start the argument, I merely voiced an opinion. An argument requires a contrary opinion, which he provided. Ergo, you might then say that it was actually LP (who has far less experience in the annals of political discourse than I*) who started the argument.

As for whether LP is Dem or Rep, it was LP himself who decided that it mattered what each of us are when he asked Lara directly if she was a Republican/Bush supporter, as though to answer in the affirmative would be to denounce any merit in her opinion.

My point was simply that REGARDLESS of party, people punish independence and reward group-think. Jeffords went independent, and Republicans derrided him. Kelly and Miller speak out in support of Bush, clearly an independent view from the party line, and they are castigated for it.

People allowed their hatred of one man sway their opinion of another, instead of reviewing the merits of the two individuals for whom they were voting.

So like you said, I prefer you to vote for whomever you support, and not just vote to punish someone else. Wise decisions are rarely made when we use anger or hatred as our guide.

----

* I know this seems a bit egotistical, but I mention it merely to point out that he hopped into a debate where I accuse people essentially of voting with emotion instead of reason, and his entire argument was emotionally based: I hate bush, Kelly likes Bush, therefore I hate Kelly. That, ladies and gentlemen, really is the crux of the issue.

__________________
There are 10 kinds of people in the world: Those who understand binary and those who do not.

gzent

Well, Richard, I know of a couple examples that reveal the difference between the Republicans and Democrats.

First, Arnold Schwarzenegger was a keynote speaker at the 2004 Republican convention and yet he is PRO-CHOICE!!!

Think about that for a minute.

Second, Michael Moore was allowed to attend.

Third, a Democratic Senator, Zel Miller, was a keynote speaker.

Now, were there any Republicans speaking at the 2004 Democratic convention? Was Michael Savage or Ann Coulter allowed to attend the Dem's convention? Have the Dem's EVER allowed a Pro-Lifer speaker at a presidential convention?

Uh..NO, NO and NO.

Seriously, people who usually vote Democrat should take a step back and ask themselves which party really covers a wider spectrum of views and beliefs.

Greg

__________________
Harmony and understanding
Sympathy and trust abounding
No more falsehoods or derisions
Golden living dreams of visions
Mystic crystal revalation
And the mind's true liberation

Bugler997

RJ: Okay.

Regarding abortion, I still say this belief system bothers me:
Unborn children = killable
Deer = off-limits
Murderers = off-limits

I mean, WHAT?!?

__________________
Yamaha Xeno Bb (YTR-8335GS) // Monette B2
Yamaha Xeno C (YTR-8445S) // Monette C2

rjzeller

Greg/Bugler:

I do agree with both of you on both points. But the irrational midset people used when they voted can happen to anyone, Democrat or Republican. Somehow I let this get sidetracked into a D/R debate. Everyone here knows where I lie, but my real concern is simply the way people rationalize when they decide whom to vote for.

If Randy Kelly had not expressed vocally his support for Geroge W. Bush, specifically and because of the current war on terror, Chris Coleman would never have decided to run against him. And even if Coleman had decided to throw his hat in the ring and run against a member of his own party, does anyone really think he would have won the election had it not been for Kelly's endorsement of Bush?

I doubt it. Yes, it was (politically) a stupid move for Kelly. But it was also the morally correct move for him. I guess I'm just sick of society punishing people for having the courage to stand up for their convictions and actually trying to do the right thing.

I dunno...it's a sore spot with me, I guess.

We punish honesty and reward ignorance....

__________________
There are 10 kinds of people in the world: Those who understand binary and those who do not.

Lazorphaze

i hear the door to the Cage creaking open....

Manny Laureano

But why, Lazor? Everybody's been polite and clear, no? Nah, tell the guy with the hood to sit down, we're cool...

ML