CJDJazzTpt

In my opinion, and that's just what it is, I think horns can and do help in 'usable' range. I play for the most part more commercial types of music and work in the 'commercial' industry. But we all know that commercial music can basically be anything ranging from pop to jazz to classical depending on the situation. Range is a very big issue in the types of trumpet playing I do so therefore I am going to play a horn that 'helps' me out in these situations!
Before I switched over to Calicchio I played a Taylor Chicago Custom and my 'usable' range after my honeymoon period on the horn was about a fourth below what it is now on my Calicchio. I am merely saying that the horn can HELP in usable range but regardless of the fact, any trumpet player must learn to play all the notes then work to get the notes out cleanly before it can become usable range. Some horns make it easier (ex. Calicchio 1s/2) and some just are a little more difficult to attain the upper register on. So again I do feel the horn can affect one's upper register. My BREAK is between G & Ab but I have learned what my muscle memory tends to do when I get to the BREAK therefore it is less of a break for me now, yet still a break!
That was a great question Larry!

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Cory

Calicchio R32

MUSICandCHARACTER

Range is an interesting topic. Can gear help? I think so. The horn, the mouthpiece, the combination in your setup make a difference

A teacher at a conference I was at once said you have to get up to the notes you want. If it takes a small mouthpiece and an easy horn, then do it. You have to learn to swim BEFORE you can swim with gear on. Why weight yourself down? Gain the confidence, and then perhaps you can swim with lifesaving gear, etc. Learn to hit the range, and then work on the tone which might require different equipment (usually a mouthpiece).

Another piece of advice that makes sense from a more "mental" aspect is this idea: try to increase your range a half step a month. Doesn't seem like a lot. But in a year you will have gained an octave!

I have played some horns I do not think MF could hit a double on! Equipment makes a difference with diminishing returns as you get to higher level equipment.

Jim

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Dr. Jim Fox
Licensed Mental Health Therapist
Mouthpiece chart: www.ibowtie.com/tmptmpccharts.html

Tootsall

If I might put a tiny, amateur word or three into this one: Larry, you asked if a particular trumpet can help your upper register and you also indicated that you meant "PLAYING" register rather than "practice" register.

OK, I haven't got an upper register to speak of :P . But I'm pretty sure that certain "setups" (horn/mouthpiece combinations) CAN help you LEARN additional upper register and make it easier to play. From this lowly amatoor, I found that going to the GR 66*** helped "free up" my upper register (below high C) to the point where I could squeeze in a high C frequently. This was on the B1.

Then the Eclipse arrived; I stayed with the 66*** and my upper range started to "clear up" a little more.... in fact what was happening was that I was discovering that I "COULD" actually get some of those notes and so I tended to practice them more. The notes were true and "in tune" also... an advantage I'm sure you will agree.

In a moment of "Eureka" I asked Bruce Lee to please send me a GR 66**. It's a bit shallower than the *** and has (I think) a tighter backbore. HOLY COW!! A high C was available any time I wanted it and in practice I am reaching "concert" high E. More importantly the high C was as clear and clean as the G had previously been.

So what? Well, what it did (obviously) is add a tiny bit of extra resistance. Having a clean high C is only adding to the confidence so now I'm practicing more and more upper register (and lower, I might add) to the point where the high C is available "on demand" even on the 66***!

Perhaps it's a bit of a "confidence" effect (some might even call it placebo)... but the point is that, for me, the high C is now available any time I want, in concert, and clear and clean. There's room for improvement... yup; sure is! But it's there and I'm now gunning for the D and E... and confident that I'll get it.

So.... I have to say that from my perspective as an old fart still working on his range (and everything else!), equipment DOES make the upper register available. Does equipment for a serious pro "with chops to spare" make a difference? We've seen lots of posts where it is claimed that you guys can play on anything... but that GOOD equipment makes the job so much easier.... and that's an advantage, right?

It always helps to have the right wax on your skis!

CJDJazzTpt

Jim,

I was reading your post on how you mentioned to try to increase your range 1/2 step a month and after 1 year you'd have an octave more to your range.
I just wanted to merely put out there that it is more easily said than done. As Larry had mentioned before everyone has a break in their range. He mentioned that it was usually between high A and high Bb below the Dubba C. Mine is between G and Ab below the dubba C. One MIGHT be able to produce a half step a month but that is something that is hard to rush. Sooner or later the half step a month goal isnt attainable! I believe that your range does peak out and comes in slower increments after that.

I do however think that your 1/2 step a month goal is very ambitious and could very well work for a few months to increase range. Keep in mind that we are going for 'usuable' range and not just a 'practice room range'. I have been known to play a blistering Dubba C on gigs before, but I do not consider it in my usuable range. (the dubba C only seems to impress other trumpet players anyway....) I have a working high A below the Dubba C almost anyday of the week, so I consider that actual 'usuable range'.

Thanks for that suggestion....again it got me thinkin'!

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Cory

Calicchio R32

Larry Gianni

Hello all,

First:

Toots... congratulations.

With every trumpet players, certain achievements in our playing career whether we eventually play pro or amateur are milestones either set by the player or set by " trumpet norm " . Your feeling of finally having a command of a " Hi C " is definitely a perennial part of the struggle and eventual accomplishment that goes along with any trumpet players heritage and recollections in dealing with range.

Breaking into the " double ledger line " area with usable command is a milestone for every trumpet player. A " right of passage " so to speak, and I think we all realize that being trumpet player , and all that goes with it , is just as much mental as physical and the confidence that this achievement brings is just as big a factor as the hitting the " pitch " itself.
I know it really puts a " spring ' in your stride as you enter a rehersal room knowing it's in your arsenal.

Thinking back on it , I'll bet allot of us can remember , pretty close " the time in our life that we played our first " Hi C " . It's just one of those things.

Plus , I wouldn't be surprised if in about 3 to 6 months , that you could go back to your " non Hi C " equipment and play the same Hi C , on command , that seemed to elude you up to now.

Jazz ,

I think Dr. Fox's suggestion is one of the most sound pieces of advise I've read on the forum in dealing with range and it acquisition. To me , it sets a minimum and achievable goal, with realistic parameters . I have this theory that certain personalities gravitate to certain instruments and the trumpet seems to a cultivate " like moths to a flame " a certain , type A , alpha male ( sorry ladies ) , over achiever , impatient , gregarious , competitive , hard working personality with a " I want it now " attitude toward most aspects of there lives , including trumpet playing and especially in dealing with range.

What Dr. Fox suggested is realistic and attainable and all I would add would be to not go any farther , even if you can , than the 1/2 step a month. Let the new note become part of your " range vocabulary " and you'll be glad you did.

There are more breaks on the trumpet scale than alot of us realize both high and low. How about low F# to pedal F ... for some players that seems to take a while or pedal C# to pedal C ... again , it takes time to be able to play chromatically over those points with ease.
Or how about high Eb to High E ... right . Don't the notes from Hi C to Hi Eb just seem to slip somewhat gracefully upward with somewaht the same feel , but then and a whole new feeling/set is needed , at first , for the Hi E to speak and then there's the eternal wait to go from Hi F# to Hi G smoothly and successfully, even if your hi f# comes out like gangbusters.

The break at the Hi Ab ( or Hi A ) to above gets very slippery indeed. I was fortunate enough , at the tender age of 19 , to have Charley Davis help me over that hurdle.

Here's the how he had me work on it:

At your break point , he calls it a flip point , get any pitch at all, no matter how squeaky , to speak. It may be a Db C , it may be a Db E , it may be a hi B , and try to get it to lock as a very small , squeaky , yet controlled pitch.

Once you do that , work back down the scale to the note right over your break chromatically. Just BE PATIENT , because it won't feel like a normal high register note , it will feel more like your just humming into the mouthpiece , and you'll get a " slide whistle " effect up in that area at first and it will be small , narrow and squally , but it will be a note so you want to try to control the easiest pitch that seems to come out naturally at first. In theory, a Db C is just a pitch like any other pitch a instrument can produce , trumpet players are the ones who put the " mystique " label to it. " nails on a blackboard " , in theory , is a pitch, I think only Englebright can play it thou.

Here's a link to a past thread on patience and range - " The virtue of patience "

http://www.trumpetmaster.com/forums/...pic.php?t=1543

By the way , Charley will be putting up his own website soon. It will have sound clips , video clips , trumpet advise , and he's got a new CD and method books on the Adam routine that also will be eventually available.
I'll keep you posted.

Good Luck

Larry

PS - Vessehume ( Brian ) I finally found the hand written Brisbois routine Bud had wrote out that we had talked about and also one Paul Hubinon himself scribbled out on a piece of manusript paper I had forgot about. Along with a short routine , he actually drew a picture of the " mouthpiece hanging " exercise.

Send me a PM with your address.

camelbrass

What an excellent thread.

Isn't it funny, individually we set (achievable) goals but more often than not they are exactly the same as somebody elses and yes I can remember that first C. I must admit though that I'm not too hung up on range and would rather work on musicality..the benefits of middle age and ametuerism. The funny thing about it is that the more I relax about range the easier I find it to play high..now I don't pretend to be in the same league as you guys (I wish I had enough range to realise that I have a gap) but what I have realised is that the easier I play below the ledger lines the easier my range is.

As for horns that make it easier, definitely!!! A guy I play with who is a much better trumpeter (and musician) than me borrows the Taylor occasionally. He usually uses a Yammie 6335 which is a perfectly decent horn (ask Allen Vezutti)...he turned around to me one day on a gig while using the Taylor (I was using the Kanstul) and said 'You know what Trev? This horn wants to play higher..that's never happened to me before." I'm not in any way saying that the Taylor is the ideal high range horn but what I do think is that if it's well made and well thought out and well balanced playing higher is one of the things it does well...and encourages it.

Just my 02cents

Regards

Trevor

trumpetpimp

About the "break" in range...

I had a break also. It was from high C/D to double G. I could squeal a double G and play a high C and D(and a forced Eb). When I was playing West Side Story with a Toronto pro named Jason Logue helped me out.

I was messing around and warming up and squealed this quiet little G. Jason sort of looked and me sideways and I said "Yeah, I know, it's not a real note. It doesn't count." But Jason told me it did count and it was a note. "But I can't work my way up to it. It just pops out on its own". He asked if I could work down from it.

I'd never thought of that but I played the G and worked down through all the harmonics. The F#, E, D, and C all popped out just fine. I've been working on getting them louder and it's coming along nicely. I've actually lost the G but the E and F and getting quite a lot louder and more powerful.

Don't be afraid a break, just work through it and try and connect it.

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