rowuk

Shermy, it is your money and therefore your decision. There are many excellent horns out there and they all get the job done. If you have played the Kanstuls and really like them, you are not making a mistake. Narrow mindedness is making up your mind BEFORE you have played the horn.
These are traits of any good horn these days - even student grade models.
It sounds like Clayton is someone that you trust - that is always a good start! I played a few of the Kanstul line at the Musikmesse in Germany a couple of months ago. They were all great horns with a sound that would fit just about anywhere. I do not think that Kanstul is trying to define any "new" trumpet sound.
Take your Bach with you when you go to try the Kanstul. I have not had this problem with a broken in Model 37.

Take a blindfold and a friend without commercial interests but good ears too!

If your present mouthpiece is not optimal for the horn, do NOT walk out with a new mouthpiece AND horn. If a mp change is necessary, buy it and get used to it first (at least 6 months!!!!!). Then go back and retry the horn!

Play before you pay.

Do not forget, a music store does not have the right acoustics to test instruments. See if there is some large space that you can also play test in (church, school, auditorium).

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Whenever I feel blue, I start breathing again.

Shermy

Thanks for your reply Robin!! I have always found wisdom in all your posts.

Just to clarify, when I say Pro, I mean a professional player, not a dealer with any ulterior motives. I plan on having him listen to me on both my Bach and the Kanstul in a blind "audition".

As for the mouthpiece, I don't know enough yet to know if it doesn't exactly work for the horn. As of yet, it works for me better on this horn than it did on my Strad, which was about as good a fit as I could get after 15 plus years of searching for that "perfect fit" - call it a mouthpiece safari if you will. It wasn't nearly as extensive as some people do, however. I'm, I believe, in the same boat as you when it comes to equipment - it's the musician behind the horn that makes the music, the horn just makes it easier. In this case, from what I've experienced this far, it's easier on the 1601 than my Bach 37. Thus, no plans to change my mouthpiece anytime soon - though I must say Dave Monette has some intriguing literature on his stuff. My comments above were just explaining how my mouthpieces sit in the new horns as compared to the Bach and Blessing.

BTW, if my 25+ year old 37 isn't broken in yet, how much longer do I have? Kidding, I know what you mean - it might be the player and not the horn. To address the range on the 1601 as compared to the Bach 37, it is quite noticeably freer blowing up there - above high D. My chops aren't quite back to the shape they were a few years ago, but to feel a difference without being fully "in shape" has to say something, doesn't it?

I plan on playing it in my church sometime this week. I might sneak into one of the performance halls on one of the college campuses here in town too. It's summer break so there should be something available. You've got to love being able to try horns out on a trial basis!!

Again, Robin, back to what seems to be our mutual philosophy on equipment, if this horn seems to accomplish what I wanted it to, am I wrong to stop searching? This isn't meant as a rhetorical question, I would like an answer or opinion.

Cheers!
Shermy

rowuk

Shermy,
not to sound too rhetorical: our search in life for all things "better" and "more beautiful" never ends regardless if we are talking about our family, job or hobby. Once we become complacent, we get BORING!

You can go to bed assured that somewhere out there is a better trumpet-regardless of how much time and money that you invest in your search. The beautiful thing is that it doesn't matter! The colleagues that I enjoy playing with most are the ones that live and play for the minute. It makes a lot more sense to live your life to the fullest and play to the max NOW. Everyone benefits and when your new horn does arrive, you just have an improved tool. I have a new horn coming this month and can't wait, but I still have to play my present gigs in a way that keeps the contractors coming back - regardless of hardware! I never start a gig with an apology (sorry, my new horn is not here yet...........). The contractors booked ME and expect ME to live up to their expectations.

If you get the warm fuzzies with a Kanstul, then DO IT. It has ALL of the traits that a working pro's horn needs. That hardware will not limit your creativity or technique.

__________________
Whenever I feel blue, I start breathing again.

Shermy

Thanks Robin, I fully understand that there definitely is a better trumpet out there. I unfortunately don't have the time or resources to find it. I have a full time job not related at all to music, so I have to practice to keep in shape for any gigs on my free time. Learning a new instrument takes away from that very limited time. My main focus is wanting to be able to focus on the music and not get so hung up on the equipment that I'm on an endless hunt where I'm never satisfied. Of course, to your point, if you are satisfied, you will probably become complacent and boring. However, if you are satisfied with the equipment and it does allow you to express your creativity, does not limit your abilities, and allows you to get better and more beautiful, why continue to put yourself through the time and effort of continually changing and growing accustomed to new equipment - especially when it comes at the expense of losing the very limited productive practice time that you have?

So far, this new horn (I've had it for about 5 days now) seems to allow me to focus more on the music a bit better than my old set up. There are a few idiosyncrasies that I will need to learn to adapt to but they seem to be more than made up for by the improvements I perceive. I have a lesson with a pro this afternoon. I plan to play my old set up and new for him.

Shermy

I took both Bbs and both fluegels to the pro yesterday. I've played with this guy on a gig before, so he's heard me play, but it was in a big band setting a few years ago. So, I played on the Bach first to let him hear how I sound on it. I know, not a true blind test. It still was effective. Next I let him play on my Bach. After that, I played it again for a few notes. Then I played the same thing on the Kanstul. He said it definitely sounds darker, which is somewhat what I am looking for. Next, I let him play it. He felt it was much freer blowing than the Bach and definitely more responsive (all traits I experience as well). I then asked him to try to play up above high D on my Bach. He wasn't quite warmed up, but said it feels really stuffy up there. He did the same on the Kanstul. He was able to move around up there quite a bit more easily. I then took out the single radius slide and put in the double radius slide and played it for him. He said it made the sound a little bit brighter and more focused.

So, the verdict for the trumpet is - It's a Keeper!! To reiterate, from my experience (as compared to my Bach 37) it is freer blowing, a little darker in tone, has better intonation, isn't stuffy above a high D, and with the additional slide becomes a little brighter and more focused. Also, the valves are awesome and it looks beautiful.

The fluegel is a no brainer. We both played it. It's amazing how well this horn speaks. He only had one complaint about either of the horns. He said the valves on the fluegel were a little too fluffy for his liking. He would prefer some stiffer springs. That's an easy fix, if I ever think I would need it. I don't mind, or really detect, the fluffyness.

Verdict on the fluegel - Keeper.

I'll be giving Clayton a call later today to let him know he can run that credit card through.

rowuk

Congratulations!
Shermy, I did not mean to fuel a further search for a horn. Regardless if you have a $20,000 Monette - there will always be some other horn that is probably better. If not right away, then after the next series of instruments comes out.
My point is that once you have hardware that gives you the warm fuzzies, you can let go. That doesn't mean that you are blind to what the market is doing, it just means that you are having a great time getting the job done with YOUR new ax. If fate has a new horn in store for you in 5, 10, 20 years, you will get the message!
How about some pictures of the new baby!!!!?

__________________
Whenever I feel blue, I start breathing again.

Shermy

Thanks Robin,

I knew your intentions. I'm sorry if you took my questions as an arguement. I meant them as true questions to a person that seems quite knowledgeable on the subject. I just wanted to make sure I was making a correct decision. Afterall, it's the most money I've ever put down on anything other than my car and house.

Pictures are to come!!

Now I need to get some paying gigs so I can justify buying these babys!!

regularsopguy

awright! another "kanstul covert"!

TisEkard

welcome to the Kanstul brotherhood, u have now been cleansed

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Drake F. Peterson