Thevor

Thanks Noel,

Being an engineer, I have found that I never stop learning nor do I find myself stuck with a tool just because its the one started with. For instance, with mechanical design the general CAD package used early on for colleges was AutoCAD. It was a great program for its day but has been vastly surpassed by many many other design packages. I constantly see two dangers, the novice who's only experience is limited to that one package and usually proclaims "since my college used it, it must be the best" and the old pro that never tried anything new because changing was a bit too daunting. The later is easily justified, "well everyone else is using it so why try something different?" BTW, after using the same program for 15 years I decided it had seen better days and went with a new package. The change was difficult but after seeing the new tools, the power and abilities of the program, I was quickly convinced its not always best to stay with something just because it got you there.

I was able to play a Calicchio that recently had a Pilczuk lead pipe and and valve alignment done by Rich Ita, gads, that was a dream horn. I also had the opportunity to play a Kanstul custom Burbank with a s1 bell and #2 lead pipe (similar to Calicchio's) and man did that thing play as well (especially using a Reeves backbore) So, I do realize that there are great differences in the student horn vs. the pro level horn. More importantly, I know that most horns limitations about sounding good are directly related to the player (I can also attest that I can make even the best of them sound bad )

BTW Noel, I will get my hands on my Olds Ambassador that has been completely customized by Leigh soon. Feel free to give it a blow while its in the shop and give me an honest evaluation of the horn before I get a hold of it.

Geo

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53' Olds Ambassador

Tampahorn

I do not totally agree that a beginner will sound bad on an expensive horn the same as they will on a professional one. About a year ago I was teaching my nephew who is a beginner student. His mother was with him but not in the same room we were playing. I let him play my trumpet, which was a 37 bach at that time. Of course he still sounded like himself, but there was enough improvement in his intonation and sound that even his mother noticed. Many of us have played student model horns and we can make them sound good but it is a lot more work. Begginers have enough trouble trying to make any horn sound good, having to struggle with a inferior horn makes it that much more difficult. My nephew got a used LA benge for about $600 better than any student horn he could have bought new.

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Ray

Lawler TL1-1A (STS)

Still Trying

Throughout my playing "career", for lack of a better term, I have been blessed with having owned some really fine horns, albeit not the most expensive ones. When I was 6, my Dad brought home a second hand Conn. I don't remember the model. He brought it in the house, pulled up the seat to my Mom's vanity table, sat up an old folding music stand, placed a newly purchased Gornston's Beginner Book on it, and announced to me that I was about to commence my studies on trumpet. It was his idea, not mine, but one of the nicest things he ever did for me.

Six years later, he traded that Conn in on an Olds Super for me. Two years after that he brought home an Olds Recording, and told me I was going to have to pass on the Super to my younger sister. After I graduated from college I bought a 1967 vintage Bach Strad. I no longer own the Strad, but I have added a Classic French Besson. I can truthfully say, I've always been blessed with top of the line horns to play. For what it is worth, I second the very obvious fact that the player creates his own sound. I cannot tell any difference in the way I sound on my Olds Recording or my French Besson Classic. I don't think anyone else can.

But all horns don't play the same, another point that cannot even be debated. I'm all for a student having the advantage of the best horn he can get his hands on, but with the stipulation that his teacher instill in him a respect for the proper care of his horn. I was taught not to eat, when I played from the age of 6. If I was thirsty, I was to drink water. If I got hungry, I was to wait until I finished playing to satisfy that urge. The horn was supposed to be replaced safely in its case, when not being played. Care was supposed to be taken, even when marching, to protect the instrument at all times. That kind of stuff was drilled into my thick little head. I still won't drink anything, but water, when I'm playing.

But I'm in a community band with kids straight out of high school. I've seen them carry sugar laden soda pops into a rehearsal with them and blow the stuff straight down the lead pipes of the shiney new Bach Strads that Mom and Dad bought them. One rehearsal they ate pizza and fried chicken during a break and then blew that stuff into their horns after washing it down with Cokes. I've seen them eat dill pickels dipped in salt and blow that into their horns, and all types of foodstuffs, which can do nothing but harm their instruments. My flesh cringes each time I witness this desecration of a fine horn. I know I'm old fashioned and judgmental. But I don't think someone, who hasn't been taught enough respect for his horn to properly care for it, needs a good horn. For them the Indian made models ought to be just fine. So give a young student the best horn possible? Yeah, but make sure he knows how to care for it first. Just my $.02.

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S.T.

What do we have that we did not receive, and if we received it, why do we glory, as if we received it not?

JACKKANSTUL

On horns making a difference or not let me offer this real life experience of one brass players observations at our music educators convention here in Arizona. This guy was selling for Wenger Choral Stands and is a brass player from North Carolina. His booth was next to mine for the 2 day convention. I had the whole factory on display, everything from the copperbell horns that some of the best in the world record on to the Marching Brass used by the worlds best bands and corps. The Kids were allowed to play them all and they did. After observing this for two full days he comes up to me and says,"I've been watching all these kids play your horns for two days now and EVERYONE that played on them sounded good. I knew it HAD TO BE THE HORN and not the player." You see this fellow was fortunate enough to have witnessed that. And I let him know he is one of the few people in the world to have witnessed it. You see when you understand this thing to the degree my father does then you can get it to do things like that. Where the instrument is actually RESONATING so well that anyone that blows into it gets a good sound. The person that needs the better RESONATING TUBE is the person that can't manipulate it like an Arturo or Doc. And that is most players. So yes a horn can make a huge difference in your playing if its a KANSTUL. Remember:Nothing Resonates like a Kanstul. Nothing!

To The Music-On a Brasswind it's in the Resonance.

Jack Kanstul

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WE SELL KANSTUL

Larry Gianni

Hello

I'd like to share with you a quote by Del Stagers,

" When a veteran in the business gives you advise, listen carefully to what he has to say...The chances are a 100 to 1 that he is right "

Now, in every professional field of endeavor whether it be engineering, architecture, teaching, accounting, cooking, economic, business, sports,etc. there are members of that field that would be considered " learned and respected " to anyone associated with that career path because of what they have achieved and the high degree of accomplishment they have under their belts. Outside the so called " inner circle" they would not be such a " household " name . Right

Seeing that a forum of this nature has members of all different achievements, accomplishments and calibers , maybe the name " Wilmer Wise " doesn't hold the " weight " it has with "the folk" that do do this for a living.

Again, there are forum participants that are very adept at forming concise and cohesive writings, putting thought to paper , maybe more that others. That's only natural in an open member situation as this one is.

Here's a little story,

When I was much younger , and a little full of myself, one of my most influential trumpet teachers once said to me when I was questioning some minute point he was making ,trying to elevate myself to a level I was not yet at, he finally turned to me after patiently waiting for me to come back down to earth and finish my long diatribe I was on and firmly stated:


" Larry

Jesus Christ, stop trying to pick the fly s*** out of the pepper - that's the easy part. Try to get ahold of the bigger concept here, will ya "

It's funny what you remember when your young.

Food for thought

Larry

lonelyangel

Hey Larry, I was like that too when I was a kid!

Good to see you posting as ever.

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Noel Langley - Eclipse Artist noel@eclipsetrumpets.com

Eclipse Medium Yellow, scratch gold
Eclipse Medium Heavy Red, custom 'Diamond Back' in 24ct gold
Eclipse Red Brass Flugel
Custom Scherzer piccolo with copper Wedgewood bell, finished in scratch gold
Giardinelli 6S, 6M, 6FL Bach 3CW