Tootsall

trpt2345

Just to show there is a wide variety of opinion on even the simplest subjects, here's something I learned from Rich Szabo: take the mouthpiece out, squeeze a bunch of oil into the leadpipe, and then blow vigorously into the horn while flapping the valves up and down. Spreads the oil from the inside, and you don't have to reset the valves. I have found this to work in a pinch. There was a long argument about this on the aol trumpet boards a while back.

Michael McLaughlin

"Politics doesn't make strange bedfellows - marriage does."
Groucho Marx

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trumpet blower88

But then you'd have to buy a new bottle every week....

I like the similar idea of taking out the slides and putting some in there.

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TRUMPONIMUS

[quote="Deecy"]I'll add a YIKES, and double yours .. YIKES YIKES!!

You valves have the holes in the bottom and top for One Reason ... to allow the pressure of the air as you press and release the valves to have some place to go other than out the bottom of the valve! ... and they are hollow for a couple of reasons.
One, to facilitate that action and two, if they were solid, it would create a Vacuum type effect (not quite, but similar) when depressing the valves.
Except for the hole in the bottom valve cap and the opening around the valve stem, the pressure would have no other place to go
As far as putting oil in through the lead pipe that should only be done in emergencies for a quick fix. When you do this it pulls some of the gunk from the lead pipe into the valve section.

gzent

Well, I thought everyone knew how to oil their valves, I guess I was wrong.

1) Remove valve and wipe it off with a nonabrasive cloth - a clean, old cotton tshirt works fine, new cheesecloth works great. Do NOT use paper towels, they can leave bits of paper behind.

1A) If you happen to have rubbing alcohol, spray it on the valve, repeat 1.

2) Remove bottom valve cap and swab it with a seperate cloth.

3) Swab the cylinder with your 1st cloth until dry.

3A) If you happen to have rubbing alcohol, spray a fine mist, not too much, into the cylinder, repeat 3.

4) Replace bottom cap

5) Apply droplets of oil onto valve in an even pattern and wait a few seconds, about 1/3 of it will be covered - any more than this will just be pushed out of the way when you replace the valve.

6) Insert your valve. If it spins freely then rotate it until it is in the locked position. If it does not spin freely then remove it align it to the guide and insert it. Screw the top cap down.

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Tootsall

I reckon you and Deecy are immune to irony? Why do you think I even mentioned that?

And...I'm against oiling the horn by spraying oil through the leadpipe ONLY IF AND UNLESS YOU HAVE JUST FINISHED BATHING THE ENTIRE INSTRUMENT AND DRIED IT OUT! Otherwise you can just be using the oil to help rinse/blow "tiny bits" (food, bacteria, lint, dirt) into the valves. There, now I've "defined" tiny bits for you as well. Same for pulling the slides and oiling the valves through the ferrules.

Expensive? naaa... we all know that the more oil you buy the cheaper it gets (by unit volume).

Principles of physics? Well, as a professional mechanical engineer for the last 20+ years I think I do know a thing or two about physics... maybe even tribology.

NickD

Um, I think we're making a bit much out of this, but that's just my opinion.

OK, spinning the valves isn't the best thing to do as they are designed to go up and down and each of us pushes them up and down in our own unique way. The valves on each hron tend to break in a little differently for the player who owns it and uses it the most. Spinning the valves tends to buff them a bit differently and can mess them up.

I agree with Mike's thing about blowing the oil through the horn. He picked that up from Rich. I picked it up from Schilke. There is one drawback, IMHO. If you are a bit more "anal" and keep your horn clean - brushing out the lead pipe and running water through it at least twice a week, pouring oil in the lead pipe can be a very nice thing to do. It tends to help keep crud from building up too fast in the horn and can reduce the deterioration for the brass inside the horn.

However, if you're like me (a total slob!) and tend to clean the horn when it starts to play funny (i.e. when you've got a full blown high school biology project growing in there), oiling this way could dislodge more crud and run that back into the valves. This is just why I don't do this (pour oil in the lead pipe). I am playing so much and that it gets messed up pretty fast and I tend to let it go too long. Alas, old habits die hard.

I take my valves out, wipe them off with a soft cloth, oil 'em up and just stick them right back in and go. Nothing to fancy or careful. Oh, I do try to not drop the valves.

OK, I'll shut up for a few mintues.



Nick

Dough! Toots got in there just in front of me!

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Deecy

Most new horns come with a printed warning NOT to spin the valves! Spinning lapped-in valves increases play and ultimately destroys their close tolerances. A BIG mistake! As is swabbing the interior of the cylinders with anything. If particulate matter is getting into the cylinder it means that someone is not brushing their teeth before picking up the trumpet.
If I had to go through such a ritual as here described, I'd switch to guitar.

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gzent

Notice I said if the valves spin FREELY ?

"Spinning a lapped-in valve increases play and ultimately destroys their tolerances" - what a crock. Have you ever lapped a valve? I have - it requires an abrasive compund and applied force. Rubbing smooth perfectly clean valves against clean brass will not cause the kind of wear you are talking about, its the contaminants that cause wear.

In fact, in some cases you may need to use a burnishing tool, which is a standard brass repair tool, and apply metal to metal contact to straighten a bent case. Burnishing, which entails manipulating a softer metal with a harder metal, does not destroy tolerances, it restores them.

The manufacturers warning is to cover their butts from beginner's mishandling their equipment.

"If particulate matter is getting into the cylinder" - again, what do you mean "if". Valves get dirty and junk gets in there which must be removed to ensure smooth action and prevent abrasion. Swabbing out the cases is necessary, otherwise why would you ever clean them?

Spend some time working in a brass repair shop and you may learn something.

__________________
Harmony and understanding
Sympathy and trust abounding
No more falsehoods or derisions
Golden living dreams of visions
Mystic crystal revalation
And the mind's true liberation

NickD

Gzent,

I hadn't thougth about the buffing coumpund thing. Good point.

Personally, I do TRY to not spin my valves, but in the heat of battle (gigs) I sometimes put them in backwards. I srta need to spin them (just a little bit!) to get some air through the horn.

Well, I've learned something! Cool!

Peace!

Nick

PS: I use an old sweat sock to wipe my pistons off!

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NickD
"Free Online Lessons in Extreme Trumpet Playing"
http://www.nickdrozdoff.com
http://www.newyorktrumpetcompany.com/
http://www.myspace.com/nickdrozdoff