Mzony

This is a touchy topic. We have all disagreed with a conductor's instructions. Some of us (like me) learned really slowly how to deal with such moments.
There are conductors who want to mess with you...I have, but there are also musicians who like to make the conductor uncomfortable...I've unfortunatley done this too.
I have said and done some things that I truly regret to some conductors. I try to remind myself that I am a member of a large group of individuals...all of whom have their own opinions about pitch, sound, phrasing, articulation, style, etc. Sometimes I have to lay down burdon and allow others to have their way and serve their visions in as artistic a way as possible.
I have never "won" an argument with a conductor, they get their way or they will make you pay.
I wish I could be a grown up already...

Johntpt

A long time ago, a teacher of mine gave me some good advice for playing trumpet in the orchestra: "Keep your mouth shut and your ears open." Simple, but it works for me. I've worked for 9 years for a conductor famous for screaming at and insultling trumpet players. Somehow we get along just fine and occasionally I even do the silly things he sometimes asks for!

Also, not only conductors, but colleagues around the orchestra appreciate trumpet players who don't talk much in rehearsals. I've heard so many stories about trumpeters who are always telling woodwind players how to tune, how to play, etc, etc. The funny thing is that those players tend to be remembered not for being great players, but for making too many comments to others! Treat others with the respect you think you deserve, and life will be easier for all involved.

JU

Manny Laureano

That sort of thing, the CONSTANT engaging of conductors, is very, very damaging to the morale of an orchestra and here's why: there are many more mechanisms in place to deal with jerk conductors than there are with disruptive musicians. Oh, sure... there are things on paper that spell out behavior, etc. The fact of life is that in America musicians are not good at policing themselves on a host of issues. Nobody wants to be the rat that says "Enough!". There's grumbling in the locker room and on the street but rarely do the musicians take somebody aside and say "You're acting like a jerk!". It happened once at the MO and the problem was alleviated for a while. I once got within a hair's breadth of coming to blows with someone on stage with whom I'd finally had it because of his unprofessional behavior. It was very ugly thing. It should not have gotten so bad that it would get to that point.

Many people are also very clever about the way they do these unprofessional things and manage to always JUST stay under the radar but everyone knows what they're up to. Very aggravating, indeed. There's a situation in Seattle with a lawsuit that's going to get ugly. I actually went to school with the guy involved and it doesn't surprise me one bit, having known him then.

Maybe psychological profiles are going to be the next thing when people win jobs now because of guys like this.

ML

Alex Yates

Some of you might want to check out this book. It was a very enlightening read for me. It is very reader friendly and not too clinical.

The Musical Temperament by Anthony E. Kemp Psychology and Personality of Musicians

Book Description
It is generally accepted that exceptionally skilled people in society, such as airline pilots and brain surgeons, have significantly different personalities from those of the general population. Similarly, a kind of folklore has long existed within musical circles that there are fundamental personality differences between the players of different instruments. Dr. Kemp examines this fascinating issue, as well as several others in light of his ten years of research in the field.

In their attempts to understand the nature of musicianship, music psychologists have generally focused their attention on cognitive processes and abilities. Although a kind of folklore has long existed within musical circles relating to personality differences between players of different instruments, this is the first book to examine the impact of personality and temperament on musicianship. After an introductory chapter which summarizes the relevant personality theories, the book deals with each facet of musicians' personality in turn: introversion, independence, sensitivity, anxiety, and gender issues. Different forms of musicianship (such as orchestral playing, singing, and conducting) are considered next, to clarify the ways in which specific skills impact upon personality development or predispose a person towards different instruments and styles of performance.

tpter1

That sounds fascinating, Alex.

This whole discussion is very eye-opening for me, and is actually very important and relevant to what I do, so I am keeping my eyes on it rather closely.

__________________
-Glenn
"Roses have thorns; shining waters mud. Clouds and eclipses stain the moon and the sun; and history reeks of the wrongs we have done. After today, after today, consider me gone."- Sting

Alex Yates

You're right Glenn, it is fascinating. The most interesting part of the book for me was what each instrumentalist's impression was of other instrumentalists. The brass were seen as "unintelligent" by most other instruments, which annoyed me, but we have all worked with some brass players who like to broadcast their stupidity sometimes. LOL. Seriously though, it was very interesting all in all. We, as trumpeters, have our own unbecoming opinions of other instruments and those who play them, so I guess fair is fair...but I don't like being seen as "stupid". If you read no other part of the book, read that part. It is VERY eye-opening indeed when trying to understand the dynamics between instrumental personalities.

Benjamin

Brass players unintelligent? What about the violas?

__________________
Benjamin E. Browne
National Radio Symphony (SODRE) - Uruguay
Filarmonica de Montevideo
Escuela Universitaria de Música-Universidad de la Republica - Uruguay