TrentAustin

Ed,

I love the line in one of these clips:

"Ask yourself... if you want to be a musician or if you NEED to be a musician".

That's a line we should always ask ourselves.

__________________
Trent Austin
lurking around. If you want to chat PM me.
http://www.trentaustin.com
http://www.onlinejazzimprovisation.com

rowuk

Ed, you make such a compelling case for your leaving the orchestra and SERVING the trumpet community that fits here perfectly! I'll ask next time though...........

__________________
Whenever I feel blue, I start breathing again.

ecarroll

Robin,

No need to apologize. . . and no need to ask. The web is public domain.

Cheers,
EC

MJ

I am late to the party but I think this is an incredibly important discussion. I have read a bunch of great posts and although I really want to agree with *double major and be more well rounded*, I can't. If you have dreams of playing in an orchestra, or want to play professionally and make a living performing, there are too many players with too much talent devoting every minute to the trumpet. For -most- people it would be impossible to compete with them for the few jobs that are available. Of course there are exceptions.

I would encourage honesty between students pursuing performance degrees and their teachers . I understand that it is hard, if not impossible, to predict what a student will be able to accomplish. However, by the end of a students senior year of college I think experienced teachers should have a good idea of where their student stacks up. I doubt any teacher would want to say "hey look this might not work out and I want to talk about other options" but it might be the best thing for the student in the long run. I'm not saying teachers should crush dreams... but before a student tacks on another $10 - $20,000+ on 2 years of buying time in a masters -performance- program there should be some serious discussion about the realities of the situation... If you don't have a job by the time you leave school and want to survive as a full time musician you will

1. Take every paying gig you can find 2. Teach private lessons

How many Music Schools prepare performance majors for teaching the instrument? (even just one or two credit hours?) How many require a semester in big band? How many prepare students for the "business of music"?

I think teachers owe it to their students to be honest with them regarding their chances and students need to be aware of the realities of making a living when you don't have a "job". Finally, I think Music Schools should take into account the fact that the majority of their "performance majors" will never have a full time orchestra job and adjust their curriculum and requirements to prepare them for the business accordingly.

MJ

__________________

MJ

Great video Ed!

__________________

Schwab

Thats a fantastic post MJ. I haven't played the best gigs in the world, but I'm lucky because I've been able to make my living playing trumpet, and it had a lot to do with luck. Knowing the right person at the right time. Of course, you have to deliver when it comes down to it, but if Gino hadn't hooked me up with my first gig, I often wondered what my life would be like.

I agree with teachers telling students the way it is too. This is a tough business. I like playing music, but I hate the music business. People should know what they're up against when they graduate, they are competing with all the trumpet players who have been already been working and have 10, 15, 20 years more experience! There are only so many gigs!

__________________
Dylan Schwab
Stage 1 New York

Vulgano Brother

I got my B.A. in performance (because otherwise I would have had to have taken class voice-shudder) and my M.A. in Brass Pedagogy. I didn’t have to mess around with deviant psychology like the Education majors (I got to live it!) or any of the sociology of group dynamics. I did get to learn about learning, dissect trumpet playing, and put the pieces together in a holistic method. Essentially, I could then teach myself effectively, and students as well. After a multi-decade career I now “perform” once a week, but the abstract reasoning and empathy I learned as a musician (and the social skills developed working with a bunch of crazy musicians) has served quite well working with homeless people. A performance degree is not worthless, but it is under-valued.

__________________
www.letsbuildhope.org

Hags888

This is a great topic...it's one that I find myself discussing with musicians all the time. I think about the future of music in our culture on an almost daily basis. In terms of getting a performance degree, if you're the only brass player in your school getting a performance degree, and there are no full-time professional music ensembles in your area...then yeah, it's a myth. If you're in that situation, you're paying thousands of dollars (or maybe you're getting a big scholarship) for lessons and practice time with no connections to speak of at the end of it. However, if you're surrounded by the best music students in the country who are also seriously studying classical music, and you have access to some of the highest quality professional music ensembles and musicians in your area, then it IS a reality. As others have said, in that instance you're benefiting from crucial networking opportunities, and connections with the best in the business.

Being a professional musician (read: freelancer) is as much about being business savvy and having an entrepreneurial perspective about music, as it is about practicing your scales, etudes and excerpts. To survive as a freelance musician, it takes networking skills, people skills and ORGANIZATIONAL skills. And oh yeah, on top of all that, you need to be able to play your instrument well. I don't know a single freelance musician in the Minneapolis/St. Paul area who doesn't support themselves with playing AND teaching or something else, and all of them know the networking game. Obviously those musicians in the full-time ensembles are supporting themselves with only playing....but they aren't freelancers.

Lastly, it's up to the next generation to change the face of music in our society. We can spend hours and hours alone in the practice room, but for what? We have to make the business connections and create work for ourselves. The days of concert promoters and managers seem to me to be dwindling. After the popular music explosion of the 1960s and 1970s, we live in a different world now, and if we want classical music to still matter, we have to make it matter, cause nobody else is gonna do it for us. Personally I'm excited to potentially have a hand in making classical music (not just orchestral music) matter again. For me personally, I'd rather have tried to make it as a classical musician and failed, then not have bothered.

__________________
Do or do not. There is no try.
http://www.scotthagarty.com

ecarroll

Scott,

Wonderful post and I too think about this topic on a daily basis. I'd be remiss as a teacher if I didn't.

The quote above particularly resonated with me and I hope that all TMers take it to heart.

Best,
EC

holyjunk

You guys should talk some more.