Pianissimo flutter tonguing

Alex Yates · 02-22-2006, 01:24 AM

How do all of you cope with that? In otherwords, do you have a technique or trick you use to keep it going when making a decrescendo?

trumpetmike · 02-22-2006, 03:05 AM

I practise starting at a comfortable volume and getting quieter.

I find starting a note fluttered at pp more difficult, but if I think a slightly slower flutter it seems to help.

lonelyangel · 02-22-2006, 08:55 AM

Practice the Caruso breath control studies SLS on the six notes. Its really to do with efficiency of playing and supporting the air stream equally at slow or fast air speeds.

All the best. Noel.

dizforprez · 02-22-2006, 10:30 AM

I try to accomplish the same things Noel and Mike suggest by fluttering one( or two) flow study pattern as part of my warm-up. I also think "slow flutter" and it seems to help.

Alex Yates · 02-22-2006, 12:50 PM

Thank you all. I have done most of what has been mentioned, but my question is a bit more specific. Yes, slow flutter is great for soft playing, but what do you do when you are fluttering away at a comfortable volume and must decrescendo as you complete a phrase? That is what I am asking about more specifically. When coming down in volume from "f" or "mf" to "p", how do you keep the flutter going without interruption?

PhatmonB6 · 02-22-2006, 12:52 PM

I am sure Manny could help with this one.

Alex Yates · 02-22-2006, 01:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PhatmonB6

I am sure Manny could help with this one.

Yes, I am sure once he takes off his Maestro hat and puts his trumpet hat back on, he will come to my rescue. LOL.

BTW - I love the new avatar. Great pic of Dizzy.

lonelyangel · 02-22-2006, 01:53 PM

Alex, if you practice the SLS Caruso study you will be starting at pppp and making a crescendo to your loudest volume and then back down again. Play them first without fluttering, so you get used to the increase and decrease in air speed, and then introduce a flutter. You may find that you cannot get the notes to start so quietly, due to the disturbance your tounge causes to the air stream, and you may also not be able to play so loudly when you are fluttering for the same reason.

It may not ever be possible for you to control a fluttered note in the same dynamic range as a clean note - but if you practice this technique you will surely push back the parameters within which you can flutter.

I tend to disagree woith the idea of thinking of a slow flutter however.

My suggestion would be to try to keep the rate of flutter constant and to focus on how it feels to be fluttering at any given airspeed. Then as you increase or decrease the airspeed try to keep hold of the feeling of fluttering - just as in the regular study you would focus on holding on to the vibration in your lips.

Hope this helps. Noel.

Alex Yates · 02-22-2006, 02:27 PM

Thanks so much Noel! I will try what you suggest. It makes perfect sense.

PhatmonB6 · 02-22-2006, 02:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trompetvrouw

Quote:

Originally Posted by PhatmonB6

I am sure Manny could help with this one.

Yes, I am sure once he takes off his Maestro hat and puts his trumpet hat back on, he will come to my rescue. LOL.

BTW - I love the new avatar. Great pic of Dizzy.

Thanks...Dizzy was and still is something...I am setting up a lesson with Mr. Laureano the end of March...he is one busy individual!!!

02-22-2006, 01:24 AM	#1 (permalink)
Alex Yates Forte User Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Atlanta, GA Posts: 2,405	Pianissimo flutter tonguing How do all of you cope with that? In otherwords, do you have a technique or trick you use to keep it going when making a decrescendo?

02-22-2006, 08:55 AM	#3 (permalink)
lonelyangel Pianissimo User Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: London Posts: 196	Practice the Caruso breath control studies SLS on the six notes. Its really to do with efficiency of playing and supporting the air stream equally at slow or fast air speeds. All the best. Noel. __________________ Noel Langley - Eclipse Artist noel@eclipsetrumpets.com Eclipse Medium Yellow, scratch gold Eclipse Medium Heavy Red, custom 'Diamond Back' in 24ct gold Eclipse Red Brass Flugel Custom Scherzer piccolo with copper Wedgewood bell, finished in scratch gold Giardinelli 6S, 6M, 6FL Bach 3CW

02-22-2006, 12:52 PM	#6 (permalink)
PhatmonB6 Mezzo Piano User Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Minnesota Posts: 668	I am sure Manny could help with this one. __________________ Bach Strad 180S37 Monette B2 Well, if I could play like Wynton (Marsalis), I wouldn't play like Wynton. Chet Baker

02-22-2006, 01:53 PM	#8 (permalink)
lonelyangel Pianissimo User Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: London Posts: 196	Alex, if you practice the SLS Caruso study you will be starting at pppp and making a crescendo to your loudest volume and then back down again. Play them first without fluttering, so you get used to the increase and decrease in air speed, and then introduce a flutter. You may find that you cannot get the notes to start so quietly, due to the disturbance your tounge causes to the air stream, and you may also not be able to play so loudly when you are fluttering for the same reason. It may not ever be possible for you to control a fluttered note in the same dynamic range as a clean note - but if you practice this technique you will surely push back the parameters within which you can flutter. I tend to disagree woith the idea of thinking of a slow flutter however. My suggestion would be to try to keep the rate of flutter constant and to focus on how it feels to be fluttering at any given airspeed. Then as you increase or decrease the airspeed try to keep hold of the feeling of fluttering - just as in the regular study you would focus on holding on to the vibration in your lips. Hope this helps. Noel. __________________ Noel Langley - Eclipse Artist noel@eclipsetrumpets.com Eclipse Medium Yellow, scratch gold Eclipse Medium Heavy Red, custom 'Diamond Back' in 24ct gold Eclipse Red Brass Flugel Custom Scherzer piccolo with copper Wedgewood bell, finished in scratch gold Giardinelli 6S, 6M, 6FL Bach 3CW

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02-22-2006, 03:05 AM	#2 (permalink)
trumpetmike Forte User Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Farnham (a place too smal Posts: 1,202	I practise starting at a comfortable volume and getting quieter. I find starting a note fluttered at pp more difficult, but if I think a slightly slower flutter it seems to help.

02-22-2006, 10:30 AM	#4 (permalink)
dizforprez Forte User Join Date: Nov 2003 Posts: 1,028	I try to accomplish the same things Noel and Mike suggest by fluttering one( or two) flow study pattern as part of my warm-up. I also think "slow flutter" and it seems to help.

02-22-2006, 12:50 PM	#5 (permalink)
Alex Yates Forte User Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Atlanta, GA Posts: 2,405	Thank you all. I have done most of what has been mentioned, but my question is a bit more specific. Yes, slow flutter is great for soft playing, but what do you do when you are fluttering away at a comfortable volume and must decrescendo as you complete a phrase? That is what I am asking about more specifically. When coming down in volume from "f" or "mf" to "p", how do you keep the flutter going without interruption?

02-22-2006, 02:27 PM	#9 (permalink)
Alex Yates Forte User Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Atlanta, GA Posts: 2,405	Thanks so much Noel! I will try what you suggest. It makes perfect sense.

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