trumpetnick

Manny,

I am curious to find out how intonation on monette horns is comparing to more conventional instruments like bach, selmer, schilke etc.

As all we know especialy on smaller horns like C, D and E flat trumpets there is always few notes which needs a correction (for example on some C trumpets high E and E flat are a bit flat, and bottom c tend to be sligghtly sharp). I would like to know how Monnette equipment (mouthpieces and horns) are comparing to that. I assume that I have not been always using monette equipment and that you have tried also playing monette mp with a "conventional" horns and non-monette mp on monette horns.

Manny Laureano

Well, Nick, rather than compare one horn to another (I don't feel comfortable doing that publicly), I'll just tell you my experiences with my horns.

I finger all my E's open on all my horns irrespective of pitch (C's, Eb's, etc.).

I finger Eb's 2nd valve as well.

I notice that for low D and C# I don't have to pull out as far as I used to.

The 6th partials (high G and F#) are still a little sharp but much easier to deal with.

The middle G and F are not flat and the low C is not sharp.

When I play something like Academische Fest Overture I can play and just forget about it, I know that it'll be in tune and focused. Not so in the past with other horns.

All of this is very dependent on the proper mouthpiece, of course.

The other day, coincidentally, I was writing to Bugle75 about mouthpieces and things and she asked for advice. Okay, I gave her my opinions and that was that. Well, I was having a practice session and started thinking about what she asked a little bit more, so, I grabbed the mouthpiece I used to play and went back and forth with my Monette mouthpiece.

Oh, my G-d!

I have become accustomed to playing right down the middle of the tone without lipping notes. When I went back to my mouthpiece from 20 years ago I could not believe how bad the intonation was. It was atrocious and that was on my Bb! Can you believe it? I couldn't believe how MUCH I used to adjust without realizing it.

Of course, come the comments of "Well, So and So has been playing that equipment and they sound great!"

Goody for them.

I'm only writing about MY experiences not about someone else's. Everyone has a different way of playing, a different expectation, and different philosophy about intonation. My boss, Osmo, is a pain in the neck about intonation and you can't get away with anything, so, I have to feel comfortable and happy when I play (you know how I like to smile!).

Too much talk, yikes, sorry.

Hope that answers your question.

ML

trumpetnick

Another question popped in my mind and I hope that you don't mind...What do you use for french music? Do you have a lighter Dave's horn or do you use something else? I remember my first impression of the Marsalis' recording of Tomasi and Jolivet concerto which was : amazing playing but the sound was bit too much on the dark side for my taste...So?

Manny Laureano

The sound didn't bother me, I found it to be a rather rich sound but I'm so used to the style with which André played those pieces that it's hard to listen to anything else, I'm afraid.

For me, that music is very much about the vibrato, articulation, and very "soprano" voice style. Do you know Edith Piaf? She was the ultimate chanteuse during the 2nd World War and the 50's.

So, it's not a question of bright or dark, etc. After all, if you played a French piece on Flugelhorn, wouldn't the other characteristics I mentioned be more important?

Oh, hey, I just remembered a story...

We were playing La Valse and afterwards one of my viola colleagues came up to me and said "How did you do that?"

"Huh?"

"How do you do that?"

"What are you talking about?'

"You know there's that litle solo you have in the middle of all that...?"

"Right... yeah?"

"You suddenly turned on this style of playing and I swear you sounded like Georges Mager!"

I thanked him even though I've never heard Mager's playing I knew he was paying me a very nice compliment, but you see, Nick? It's about ears and style. After so many years fo listening to André, Piaf, Voisin... you have to learn something. That's why I wish the young ones today would realize that they need to embrace the old recordings and not eschew the old ways. There is much to be learned from them but we have to be willing to not desire the "perfection" of the latest technoloy and make that the latest god.

French music comes in many colors but we have to look at the the aspects that truly make something sound "French".


ML

trumpetnick

I do have the Maurice Andre's recordings and even some Voisins (Voisin leaded the first trumpet masterclass that I have attended), and exactly for that reason Marsalis' sound seemed to me a bit dark (I have no idea what eqiupment Maurice was using on the 60s, but I assume that it was Selmer). I am sure that there is a lot to be done as vibrato, articulation etc. but still think that some pieces are not appropriate to play on a heavy wight trumpet...You see, I like hearing heavy trumpets with a dark sound on Wagner, Mahler etc, but when you play Poulenc's Eiffel tower polka or Gay Paris my conception of the sound itself is that it should be lighter and brighter which goes all together with the articulation, vibrato etc. Obviously you can change the colour of the sound just be playing it differently, but certainly chancing the equipment helps...or at least that is my perception. Tell me if I am wrong....you won't get a rotary trumpet to play Poulenc or Francaix, right?
I still remember my first lesson with Rod Franks...He made 2 points and it is very close to what you said...
1. He said that I had not too many different articulations

2. He wanted me to control better my vibrato...He drew schemes of the most popular styles of vibrato....american, british, french, russian, soloistic...I may have forgotten 1 or 2, but I am sure that you are getting the point. Why do we change horns? Cause we want different sound. I don't know what equipment exactly do you use, but I am curious to find out...My background as far as my education is concerned is very mixed: I started in bulgaria where there is now a particular style of teaching but many trumpeters are influenced by Dokschitzer. Then I went to Switzerland where my teacher was somewhere in between german and french school: In switzerland is rather french, but he has played for ten years with Celibidache in Munich...Then I spent one year in England where Rod and other people (mainly Murray Greig) ahs thought me for few lessons or more their way...I have not had any US teachers, but I have all these recordings...mainly Marsalis and Phil Smith...My personal preference goes to Phil.
To resume you can change style by changing technical stuff, like articulations and vibrato, but the other way is to change to equipment, right?

rowuk

I agree with Manny on his intonation discourse. This does not mean that Monette is the only horn to get the job done. I still use my rotary trumpets when playing german classical and romantic music. With a suitable Monette mouthpiece, they share many of the same traits but I think the sound fits better.
Changing the horn changes only the acoustic parameters. Every type of music brings its own set of "style" requirements that cannot be reduced to "light" or "bright" or fast/slow vibrato. We have different techniques available to do justice to any piece that we tackle. It is just a matter of realizing that we will always have something new to learn!

Jimi Michiel

Mager the trumpeter or Mager the violist?

Manny Laureano

The newscaster!

ML