Most copied trumpet?

wimbouman · 10-08-2005, 12:21 PM

Hi guys!

Just curious...

What would be the worlds most copied instrument?
The Bach Strad 37? Schilke B? Meha?

Any thoughts?

Grtz,

Wim

B15M · 10-08-2005, 12:34 PM

Monette

camelbrass · 10-08-2005, 01:12 PM

The original pre-WWII Frederick (sp) Besson trumpets.

Regards,

Trevor

Jimi Michiel · 10-08-2005, 02:47 PM

Not sure if there's a clear answer, but I've seen a lot of piccs and E-flats that look a lot like Schilkes...
-jimi

tom turner · 10-08-2005, 04:44 PM

The first Perinet-valved trumpets were long, narrow bore "pea shooters" with a very bright, almost vulgar sound . . . and most orchestras used cornets!

Then, the wrap of the original F. Besson (of about 100 years ago) finally gave us a more rich and noble trumpet sound.

Although there are a very few trumpets today that are not derived from the F. Besson wrap, they are quite rare.

Vincent Bach was the first custom maker to clone a "Super Besson" in around 1924! Bach was a frustrated symphony trumpeter looking for a F. Besson (the brand he played) that didn't have leaky valves and other inconsistencies notorious on early F. Besson trumpets. Bach definately succeeded in making the first "Super Besson!"

About 15 years later ('39) Eldon Benge, of the Chicago Symphony, started making his own "Super Besson" . . . and one that was closer design-wise than the Bach. Like Bach, Mr. Benge only made a couple of horns a week . . . and also special order for specific musicians. He also succeeded, and many feel we'd all be playing BENGES today if Eldon hadn't tragically died only blocks from his home in an auto accident in 1960.

In '57 along came Mr. Schilke to make his own derivation of the famous Besson "wrap." He preferred different variations in leadpipe/tuning slide design but his horns were definately also variations of the Besson.

Today, virtually all the popular trumpets are made on a variation of the F. Besson wrap . . . with only rare exceptions.

No other design has influenced trumpets like the balky old F. Besson with that wonderful F. Besson/Bach/Benge/et al "sound!"

Sincerely,

Tom Turner

cornetguy · 10-09-2005, 09:28 PM

Besson

Schilke Piccolo P5-4

Manny Laureano · 10-09-2005, 09:35 PM

Wow, what a question!

What comes to mind is Besson before about 1945 and then Monette after about, what? 1986 or so?

ML

uatrmpt · 10-09-2005, 10:42 PM

While I think that the French Besson is the most important horn that has been copied, I think that the Bach ML 37 has the most copied designs around now. Most people have making a Bach clone as their intent, not a Besson clone. (Zeus, B&S, Yamaha, all the music store brands, some Kanstuls, etc.)

sinfoniantrumpeter · 10-09-2005, 11:05 PM

what horns are copies of monettes?

uatrmpt · 10-09-2005, 11:56 PM

The Getzen Genesis, Edwards Gen X and III, Taylors, and the Courtois are all influence by Monette, but there are other things too. Heavy bottom valve caps and tops, heavy blank mouthpieces. I'm sure there are a few more.

10-08-2005, 12:21 PM	#1 (permalink)
wimbouman New Friend Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Amsterdam, The Netherlands Posts: 18	Most copied trumpet? Hi guys! Just curious... What would be the worlds most copied instrument? The Bach Strad 37? Schilke B? Meha? Any thoughts? Grtz, Wim
	__________________ Now playing Hub van Laar B4

10-08-2005, 02:47 PM	#4 (permalink)
Jimi Michiel Forte User Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Syracuse/Fort Worth Brand: Monette Posts: 1,671	Not sure if there's a clear answer, but I've seen a lot of piccs and E-flats that look a lot like Schilkes... -jimi
	__________________

10-09-2005, 09:28 PM	#6 (permalink)
cornetguy Mezzo Forte User Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Saint Paul, MN Brand: Yamaha, Bach, Getzen Posts: 729	Besson Schilke Piccolo P5-4
	__________________ Res Severa Verum Gaudium

10-09-2005, 10:42 PM	#8 (permalink)
uatrmpt Piano User Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: AL Posts: 335	While I think that the French Besson is the most important horn that has been copied, I think that the Bach ML 37 has the most copied designs around now. Most people have making a Bach clone as their intent, not a Besson clone. (Zeus, B&S, Yamaha, all the music store brands, some Kanstuls, etc.)
	__________________ --Matt--

10-09-2005, 11:56 PM	#10 (permalink)
uatrmpt Piano User Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: AL Posts: 335	The Getzen Genesis, Edwards Gen X and III, Taylors, and the Courtois are all influence by Monette, but there are other things too. Heavy bottom valve caps and tops, heavy blank mouthpieces. I'm sure there are a few more.
	__________________ --Matt--

10-08-2005, 12:34 PM	#2 (permalink)
B15M Forte User Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Monroe Ct. Posts: 1,255	Monette

10-08-2005, 01:12 PM	#3 (permalink)
camelbrass Mezzo Forte User Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Dubai, UAE Posts: 780	The original pre-WWII Frederick (sp) Besson trumpets. Regards, Trevor

10-08-2005, 04:44 PM	#5 (permalink)
tom turner Mezzo Forte User Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Georgia, USA Brand: F. Oakes tpts/flug/cornet Posts: 788	The first Perinet-valved trumpets were long, narrow bore "pea shooters" with a very bright, almost vulgar sound . . . and most orchestras used cornets! Then, the wrap of the original F. Besson (of about 100 years ago) finally gave us a more rich and noble trumpet sound. Although there are a very few trumpets today that are not derived from the F. Besson wrap, they are quite rare. Vincent Bach was the first custom maker to clone a "Super Besson" in around 1924! Bach was a frustrated symphony trumpeter looking for a F. Besson (the brand he played) that didn't have leaky valves and other inconsistencies notorious on early F. Besson trumpets. Bach definately succeeded in making the first "Super Besson!" About 15 years later ('39) Eldon Benge, of the Chicago Symphony, started making his own "Super Besson" . . . and one that was closer design-wise than the Bach. Like Bach, Mr. Benge only made a couple of horns a week . . . and also special order for specific musicians. He also succeeded, and many feel we'd all be playing BENGES today if Eldon hadn't tragically died only blocks from his home in an auto accident in 1960. In '57 along came Mr. Schilke to make his own derivation of the famous Besson "wrap." He preferred different variations in leadpipe/tuning slide design but his horns were definately also variations of the Besson. Today, virtually all the popular trumpets are made on a variation of the F. Besson wrap . . . with only rare exceptions. No other design has influenced trumpets like the balky old F. Besson with that wonderful F. Besson/Bach/Benge/et al "sound!" Sincerely, Tom Turner

10-09-2005, 09:35 PM	#7 (permalink)
Manny Laureano Utimate User Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: USA Posts: 5,989	Wow, what a question! What comes to mind is Besson before about 1945 and then Monette after about, what? 1986 or so? ML

10-09-2005, 11:05 PM	#9 (permalink)
sinfoniantrumpeter Pianissimo User Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 84	what horns are copies of monettes?

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