The question must be asked!!!

miles71 · 11-09-2004, 11:26 AM

Ok guys,
I am new to TM and heres a little background. For the past 8 years I was a high school band director and had little time to play my horn. Before that I was a freelance player while getting my under-grad degree. Had all the horns from two b flats to picc. While teaching I got a Masters Degree and had quite a few private students. (yes I went home every once in a while). Short of a "life story", I have moved and am no longer teaching.

Since the move I have been able to play much more than usual (very nice). I am at the point where it feels good to play, just wish I could get back to the level I was about 9 years ago. I am again thinking about a new horn. I presently play a Yamaha Xeno 8335RGS and think it is a great horn. I need something that can do it all - concert band, lead work, small group, etc. The Xeno does all of that with some small problems, but is still the best horn I've owned.

The Big Question!!!! What is the best pro horn for all around playing? I have read about the Eclipse and must say it has my attention. I live in "Bach Country" but only had one of them I liked, so any help would be great. Would be nice to hear you backgrounds as well. Thanks for the help.

Castle Bravo · 11-09-2004, 11:55 AM

I'm a little biased toward Eclipse as their webmaster, but here's my 2 cents.

I have been playing for 19 years, am currently in the Army band program. I do a lot of lead work, lot of dixie, brass quintet, basically whatever people want to hear. Enough about that.

The Eclipse is in my opinion, the last horn you will ever need to buy. The flip side of that is they are all so good, you may have a bear of a time settling on just one. All of the horns are exactly the same minus the bell. The finishes and the bell are the only difference between models; so the horns are labeled 'eclipse' followed by the bell type. Mine is an eclipse MR (med red-brass bell).

The unique design of the horn is responsible for 3 of the 4 characteristics that in my opinion sell the horn - an uncannily even blow, impeccable tuning, and crisp slotting. The 4th is the valve block - best of the best (even doc uses it on his custom horn). Every horn plays and respond the same due to the uniform design across the models, and all you have to do is figure out what sound you want.

If you can find a way to try out an eclipse, do it (at your own risk). The first time I played an eclipse, I had just bought a brand new horn 8 months prior, and I sold it and bought the eclipse. I was'nt in the market for a new horn.... but once you play it, it's hard to deny the horn's caliber and class.

www.eclipsetrumpets.com

trickg · 11-09-2004, 12:04 PM

I say that if you are ready, willing and able to drop a goodly sum on a new horn, fine, but my question to you is what in the heck is wrong with the Xeno? You say that you want a horn that can do it all, but in my experience, there really is no such thing. You can find horns that are particularly good at one aspect or another of playing - for instance, a Bach Strad ML 37 is going to be a great legit horn, and does ok for other things, but if you are really serious about playing lead, it might not be for you. Likewise, a Schilke B6 is considered by some to be an amazing rock band horn, but it's not what you would want to bring to the brass quintet rehearsal. The "do-it-all" horns, such as the aforementioned Bach ML 37, usually have the shortcoming in that it has to compromise somewhere for something.

That being said, I'm going to list off some horns that I have either played or heard about that might fit that category.

Schilke S32
Conn Vintage One (depends on configuration)
Schilke B5
Lawler - Roy or Bruce Lee can answer better what his best all-around horns are
Eclipse - Top dollar, but worth every penny from what I have heard
Calicchio - Not sure which Calicchio is going to be a good all-arounder, but I know there is one
Kanstul Signature
Flip Oakes Wild Thing
Blackburn - you will have to wait and they are expensive, but they are also outstanding from what I have heard

I'm sure that others can add to this list, but that's where I would start.

Something else that I would consider if I were you would be to look into getting a Blackburn leadpipe for your Xeno. It's a much cheaper alternative to buying a new horn, and the results could be just what you are looking for.

gzent · 11-09-2004, 12:45 PM

I would add the Zeus Guarnerius to that list and would agree - what do you want to do that the Xeno can't do?

Greg

miles71 · 11-09-2004, 01:26 PM

Im just looking to improve the set up I already have. The Xeno has some small problems.

Intonation seems to suffer a bit in the 4th partial.
The square slide is a little resistant

It is a great horn and I could just stay with it, but as we are trumpet players we can never settle on what we have. Just searching for answers man.

wiseone2 · 11-09-2004, 02:26 PM

I say play on any horn you sound great on!!!!
How YOU sound is the most important consideration.
BLOW YOUR HORN.
Wilmer

ScreaminTrumpet · 11-09-2004, 03:27 PM

Recently I have played quite a few horns. I played several Kanstul trumpets and were VERY impressed with them. They are very well built horns and I would highly recommend them. Also, the Zeus trumpets have recently caught my attention. I had a chance to play them this last year at TMEA convention (Texas Music Educators Assoc.) when Reverend had his booth there. The Olympus is a fantastic horn for a great price. It all comes down to how much you want to spend! Happy shopping.

MUSICandCHARACTER · 11-09-2004, 07:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ScreaminTrumpet

Recently I have played quite a few horns. I played several Kanstul trumpets and were VERY impressed with them. They are very well built horns and I would highly recommend them. Also, the Zeus trumpets have recently caught my attention. I had a chance to play them this last year at TMEA convention (Texas Music Educators Assoc.) when Reverend had his booth there. The Olympus is a fantastic horn for a great price. It all comes down to how much you want to spend! Happy shopping.

The Olympus in made by Kanstul (as is the Wild Thing). Alex's specs are used for that horn alone. Its not for everyone, but if you want a big bore, big bell horn that doesn't spread too much, it is a fantastic horn. And the price is excellent.

In like style, the Kanstul 1500 Tim Wendt model or the 1600 Wayne Bergeron are amazing horns. Less $$ than a Schilke or Eclipse (a lot less than some others). In the Kanstul line you can get horns as bright and focused as a Calicchio and as dark and rich as Mt. Vernon. The Chicago series is very much like the Chicago Benge. Zig Kanstul worked with Eldon Benge and Foster Reynolds (of Reynolds/Olds fame) and worked in management at Conn and King. His "fingerprints" are on many of the great horns of a few years back and today. And completely made in the US.

Not that I am biased or anything.

Jim

Greg5850 · 11-09-2004, 09:33 PM

I too am a HS band director, I've played a Bach Lt37 since '78 and have tried out everything that has come along looking for something I liked better. I even spent a GREAT afternoon with Reynold Schilke himself playing his horns (years ago). What a great man!)

Everything came up short in one way or another, (although I really liked the Xeno Large 8345) until I tried the WT. I've got one on the way. It worked for me. It was just easier- less fracks, more endurance, faster technique. I think it makes me play "right". I believe I tense up more on my Bach.

Of course, people always talk up the horn they just spent big bucks on.

Bach Strad Lt37
Courtois Flugal
Burbank Pic
soon to be Wild Thing
Bach 1 1/2 C legit, Warburton 6 series Jazz

Tootsall · 11-09-2004, 10:20 PM

Hmm... good point. Maybe that's why we keep changing horns... so we'll always have something to talk about!

11-09-2004, 11:26 AM	#1
miles71 Mezzo Piano User Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Maryland Posts: 559	The question must be asked!!! Ok guys, I am new to TM and heres a little background. For the past 8 years I was a high school band director and had little time to play my horn. Before that I was a freelance player while getting my under-grad degree. Had all the horns from two b flats to picc. While teaching I got a Masters Degree and had quite a few private students. (yes I went home every once in a while). Short of a "life story", I have moved and am no longer teaching. Since the move I have been able to play much more than usual (very nice). I am at the point where it feels good to play, just wish I could get back to the level I was about 9 years ago. I am again thinking about a new horn. I presently play a Yamaha Xeno 8335RGS and think it is a great horn. I need something that can do it all - concert band, lead work, small group, etc. The Xeno does all of that with some small problems, but is still the best horn I've owned. The Big Question!!!! What is the best pro horn for all around playing? I have read about the Eclipse and must say it has my attention. I live in "Bach Country" but only had one of them I liked, so any help would be great. Would be nice to hear you backgrounds as well. Thanks for the help.

11-09-2004, 11:55 AM	#2
Castle Bravo Piano User Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Mons, Belgium Posts: 281	I'm a little biased toward Eclipse as their webmaster, but here's my 2 cents. I have been playing for 19 years, am currently in the Army band program. I do a lot of lead work, lot of dixie, brass quintet, basically whatever people want to hear. Enough about that. The Eclipse is in my opinion, the last horn you will ever need to buy. The flip side of that is they are all so good, you may have a bear of a time settling on just one. All of the horns are exactly the same minus the bell. The finishes and the bell are the only difference between models; so the horns are labeled 'eclipse' followed by the bell type. Mine is an eclipse MR (med red-brass bell). The unique design of the horn is responsible for 3 of the 4 characteristics that in my opinion sell the horn - an uncannily even blow, impeccable tuning, and crisp slotting. The 4th is the valve block - best of the best (even doc uses it on his custom horn). Every horn plays and respond the same due to the uniform design across the models, and all you have to do is figure out what sound you want. If you can find a way to try out an eclipse, do it (at your own risk). The first time I played an eclipse, I had just bought a brand new horn 8 months prior, and I sold it and bought the eclipse. I was'nt in the market for a new horn.... but once you play it, it's hard to deny the horn's caliber and class. www.eclipsetrumpets.com __________________ Gary Wilder NATO BigBand, SHAPE Belgium Webmaster, EclipseTrumpets.com

11-09-2004, 12:04 PM	#3
trickg Forte User Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Glen Burnie, Maryland Posts: 2,056	I say that if you are ready, willing and able to drop a goodly sum on a new horn, fine, but my question to you is what in the heck is wrong with the Xeno? You say that you want a horn that can do it all, but in my experience, there really is no such thing. You can find horns that are particularly good at one aspect or another of playing - for instance, a Bach Strad ML 37 is going to be a great legit horn, and does ok for other things, but if you are really serious about playing lead, it might not be for you. Likewise, a Schilke B6 is considered by some to be an amazing rock band horn, but it's not what you would want to bring to the brass quintet rehearsal. The "do-it-all" horns, such as the aforementioned Bach ML 37, usually have the shortcoming in that it has to compromise somewhere for something. That being said, I'm going to list off some horns that I have either played or heard about that might fit that category. Schilke S32 Conn Vintage One (depends on configuration) Schilke B5 Lawler - Roy or Bruce Lee can answer better what his best all-around horns are Eclipse - Top dollar, but worth every penny from what I have heard Calicchio - Not sure which Calicchio is going to be a good all-arounder, but I know there is one Kanstul Signature Flip Oakes Wild Thing Blackburn - you will have to wait and they are expensive, but they are also outstanding from what I have heard I'm sure that others can add to this list, but that's where I would start. Something else that I would consider if I were you would be to look into getting a Blackburn leadpipe for your Xeno. It's a much cheaper alternative to buying a new horn, and the results could be just what you are looking for. __________________ Patrick Gleason email me at: trickg1@hotmail.com "What we do in life echoes in eternity" "At my signal, unleash hell." - Maximus Decimus Meridius

11-09-2004, 12:45 PM	#4
gzent Forte User Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Rochester, MN Posts: 1,857	I would add the Zeus Guarnerius to that list and would agree - what do you want to do that the Xeno can't do? Greg __________________ www.bethanybrass.com - Helping fellow trumpet players achieve musical excellence

11-09-2004, 01:26 PM	#5
miles71 Mezzo Piano User Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Maryland Posts: 559	Xeno Im just looking to improve the set up I already have. The Xeno has some small problems. Intonation seems to suffer a bit in the 4th partial. The square slide is a little resistant It is a great horn and I could just stay with it, but as we are trumpet players we can never settle on what we have. Just searching for answers man.

11-09-2004, 02:26 PM	#6
wiseone2 Artitst in Residence Fortissimo User Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Brooklyn,NY Posts: 2,858	I say play on any horn you sound great on!!!! How YOU sound is the most important consideration. BLOW YOUR HORN. Wilmer __________________ Be sure Brain is engaged before putting Mouthpiece in gear. S.Suark 1951

11-09-2004, 03:27 PM	#7
ScreaminTrumpet New Friend Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Lubbock, TX Posts: 36	Recently I have played quite a few horns. I played several Kanstul trumpets and were VERY impressed with them. They are very well built horns and I would highly recommend them. Also, the Zeus trumpets have recently caught my attention. I had a chance to play them this last year at TMEA convention (Texas Music Educators Assoc.) when Reverend had his booth there. The Olympus is a fantastic horn for a great price. It all comes down to how much you want to spend! Happy shopping. __________________ Josh Revolution Drum and Bugle Corps Soprano Tech Be a part of the new Revolution in DCI!!! www.Revolutionypa.org Bb - '99 Bach Strad (customized) (1C) '65 Bach Strad 37* (all original) (BR 42s) Picc - Scherzer Bb/A Rotary (7E/3C)

11-09-2004, 09:33 PM	#9
Greg5850 New Friend Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: WI Posts: 47	Try a Wild Thing I too am a HS band director, I've played a Bach Lt37 since '78 and have tried out everything that has come along looking for something I liked better. I even spent a GREAT afternoon with Reynold Schilke himself playing his horns (years ago). What a great man!) Everything came up short in one way or another, (although I really liked the Xeno Large 8345) until I tried the WT. I've got one on the way. It worked for me. It was just easier- less fracks, more endurance, faster technique. I think it makes me play "right". I believe I tense up more on my Bach. Of course, people always talk up the horn they just spent big bucks on. Bach Strad Lt37 Courtois Flugal Burbank Pic soon to be Wild Thing Bach 1 1/2 C legit, Warburton 6 series Jazz

11-09-2004, 10:20 PM	#10
Tootsall Fortissimo User Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Yee HAW! Posts: 4,641	Hmm... good point. Maybe that's why we keep changing horns... so we'll always have something to talk about!

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