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Horns Discuss reverse lead pipe in the Equipment forums; what are the advantages of this? Do the better horns re. pro horns all have reverse lead pipe? I would ...
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    Pianissimo User
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    reverse lead pipe

    what are the advantages of this? Do the better horns re. pro horns all have reverse lead pipe? I would appreciate some info. on this. Also I see some horns with a rounder tuning slide and does this permit the air to flow through the horn more freely? Thanks Bill

  2. #2
    Mezzo Forte User tatakata's Avatar
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    Re: reverse lead pipe

    No they don't. You just have to go out and try them Bill.

    Quote Originally Posted by BILL VAN View Post
    Do the better horns re. pro horns all have reverse lead pipe?

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    Fortissimo User Brekelefuw's Avatar
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    Re: reverse lead pipe

    The idea behind a reverse leadpipe (as I understand it) is that it extends the length of tubing before there is a break (the main tuning slide). It also gets rid of the little ridge created by the main tuning slide being inside the leadpipe. The removal of this ridge makes the air and sound flow uninterrupted for a long period of time which removes a bit of back pressure caused by the ridge.
    After silence, that which comes nearest to expressing the inexpressible is music. ~Aldous Huxley
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    Moderator Utimate User Vulgano Brother's Avatar
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    Re: reverse lead pipe

    The reversed leadpipe is longer, allowing for a slower, longer taper. Some players prefer the sound/response/intonation with this set-up, which does require different bell bracing as well. It is interesting to note that the (early, at least) Monette Bb trumpets used a "normal" leadpipe, while his C trumpets used the reversed leadpipe.

    The rounded slides do offer a different resistance, as do the ovate slides.

    All of these do not make an instrument inherently better or worse, but they do make a difference.
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    Piano User gglassmeyer's Avatar
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    Re: reverse lead pipe

    Normans

    This link has some info about trumpet options including tuning slides.

    The rounded slide doesn't let more air through, but "feels" more open due to less resistance.
    With reverse tuning slide configurations the theory is that you don't have a "bump" the thickness of the tuning slide where your slide is inserted into the lead pipe. Many folks think that this can lead to a freer blowing horn and possibly more responsive. This is tough to determine though because often times in the reversed tuning slide, there will be less bracing (sometimes none). The normal Bach Strad has 1 brace between the lead pipe and the pipe leading into the valve cluster and a brace between the upper and lower portion of the tuning slide. The Strad with a reverse configuration only has the one brace. I you played both there would be a difference, but is it the bracing that effects the sound/feel or the reverse tuning slide?

    Essentially you have to play some with different options and see which configuration you like best.

    I have a lightweight Yamaha that has reverse tuning slide and no bracing between the lead pipe and lower pipe. This is a very responsive horn due to this configuration.

    My Conn Vintage One came with both the traditional "D" shaped tuning slide and a rounded slide. The feel between the 2 slides is very different with all other factors being the same. The rounded one "feels" much more open and responsive. The "D" shaped slide does add more resistance and plays with less effort, but not as responsive.

    Almost everything you can do to a trumpet will have a pro and a con. Finding the right balance for you is the key.
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    Pianissimo User KRax!'s Avatar
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    Re: reverse lead pipe

    Quote Originally Posted by gglassmeyer View Post
    Many folks think that this can lead to a freer blowing horn and possibly more responsive. This is tough to determine though because often times in the reversed tuning slide, there will be less bracing (sometimes none).
    I have had two trumpets with a reversed tuning slide (leadpipe), both with a normal number of braces, a Couesnon and a Holton. None of them was any spectacular free blower but they were both pretty responsive, at least a little bit more than most horns I have played.

    I also have a trumpet without the mentioned second leadpipe to bell brace but with a normal tuning slide, a Jupiter 1010 Tribune. It is the "Dizzy model" with interchangable bells, therefor the lack of front brace. This trumpet is far more responsive than those two above but regarding the feeling of free blowing it is at the same level.

    Not so much of experience but as far I can tell the lack of the front bell to leaderpipe brace is a bigger cause of responsiveness.

    It is my impression that it is rather common to make very good intermediate/basic pro models with reversed tuning slide (leadpipe), nowadays my Jupiter, some Yamaha and the K├╝hnl & Hoyer Topline. I get the feeling this is a marketing thing, a reverse tuning slide is cool and easy to sell to those who cannot afford a "real" new pro trumpet but want to upgrade to something hotter.

    But I have never seen a student trumpet with a reversed tuning slide.

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    Re: reverse lead pipe

    The reverse tuning slide is simply different. It's a freer blow, meaning two things. First, flexibility (lip slurs) tends to be smoother with this setup as the diminished resistance widens the "targets" on each note. What this also means is that, with larger targets, there's more room to lip pitches as there's less to "push against". So intonation may suffer, depending on the player.

    To my ears, reverse setups sound brighter than their standard counterparts. This isn't necessarily bad, just don't expect the same sound you'd get with a standard tuning slide.

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    Mezzo Forte User tatakata's Avatar
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    Re: reverse lead pipe

    Nice article Greg. Thanks

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    Moderator Utimate User rowuk's Avatar
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    Re: reverse lead pipe

    Quote Originally Posted by John P View Post
    ....

    To my ears, reverse setups sound brighter than their standard counterparts. This isn't necessarily bad, just don't expect the same sound you'd get with a standard tuning slide.
    The horn sounds brighter because more energy is reflected off of the outside of the bell. This is due to the brace being further back. I removed the front brace on a "standard" Bach and experimented with the placement of a tuning post. Without a brace the horn seemed brighter, had less projection and feeled easier to play but was much more work playing in a wind band. The sound post in the position of the original brace gave the best response. We put the brace back on!

    Just for the record, there is a "bump" in the bore size regardless if we have conventional or reversed leadpipe UNLESS we have a stepped bore configuration where the tuning slide and valve block bore is bigger than the end of the leadpipe.

    I would not use this spec to determine suitability of ANYTHING. Just play the horn, that will tell you everything that you need to know!
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