Shermy

Ok, I've searched this forum and haven't found quite what I'm looking for.

I'm posting this hoping it may help others out there as well.

I'm trying to find some pointers on how to test out a new horn in optimal conditions - i.e. a room, or better yet performance venue with no one else but maybe a knowledgable trumpet player to listen.

Should you warm up on your current horn? If so, how much?

Should you switch back and forth from your current horn to the new horn on different types of testing, or would this be detrimental?

What types of things would you play to test out the new horn?
* To test for slotting
* To test the tone quality
* To test the intonation
* To test the resistance

If the horn is of a drastically different design than your current set up, what things should you consider when testing it out?


Cheers,
Shermy

Brekelefuw

I always play things that I know I can play. I am not going to try to hit a double G, because I can't. I am going to play flexibilities, slurs, loud and soft long tones, flow things like the clark studies and chromatic scales in all registers. I will also use many different attacks to see how the horn responds to a big fat attack and how it responds to the lightest tongue I can produce.

What to try out is really your choice as long as you do the same stuff on your current horn and the one you are trying.
Having a friend there to give you critical feedback is also helpful.

rowuk

Shermy,
you should take your old horn with you as a point of reference!
You need to play the new horn in the type of rooms that you practice AND perform in.
When I try a horn, I do not immediately jump into the measurement mode - I play easy tunes that I am familiar with - second movement Haydn a couple of easy orchestra passages - just to get the general feel. If I don't get the warm fuzzies right away, then I stop and ask for something else.
Assuming the ax has passed the warm fuzzy test, I check intonation: using octaves: 3rd space C, 4th space E and Eb, G on top of the staff and high C. The only other meaningful test of intonation, would be to bring a brass quartet or quintet and play a couple of tunes - then you know for sure if it works in an ensemble.
I see no need to "check" for slotting. If I can play the passages and am comfortable then that is cool. I also do not check for resistance per se. That factor changes with every room that you play in. I do play a couple of long passages to see how quickly my air disappears. The correct balance is the ability to phrase but not to suffocate because the air is not flowing enough. That is resistance (impedance) but not really quantifiable.
Tone quality is also something that is tough to quantify - because every playing space is different AND unless you are a studio musician where the "up close" sound is what is recorded, you are playing to an audience that is 20-50 feet away. How you hear yourself play is about the same as how you hear yourself when speaking. They sound completely different!
For sound quality, you need another set of ears that you really trust.
Do not expect to make a decision based on 30 minutes in a music store. There is NOTHING there that will aid your decision. The salesman, the acoustics, your anxiousness are all in the way of an objective decision.

You forgot one of the most important factors of choosing a trumpet:
how well does it play SOFTLY? Most of your performing life, other players and conductors will consider you to be TOO DAMN LOUD. If you have a brilliant horn that is magic starting at mezzo forte, you have a problem!

Don't forget the physical characteristics either. Does the pinky ring and 1st and 3rd tuning slide rings fit? Does the horn seem to be balanced in your hand?

Vulgano Brother

In addition to the above: By all means bring a friend, and have them blindfold you, and then hand trumpets to you. Sometimes we can be so fixed on brand A that we neglect brand B. Have your friend pull the tuning slides or tune the instrument: often the sharpest trumpet sounds the "best."

gchun

A couple of suggestions:

Bring a tuner. Test the intonation in differents registers at different volumes. Slow crescendos & decrescendo give you a feel for how easy it is to control the dynamics with different volumes.

Bring a recorder. Place the recorder at different distances. Record your regular horn also so you have a basis for comparison.

See if you can borrow the horn for trial at a gig or rehearsal. Also record that rehearsal.

Good luck,
Garry

Shermy

Excellent pointers all! Thanks!!

I will have a 7 to 10 day trial period with my new trumpet and fluegel once they get here (Kanstul ZKT 1601 TW with single and double radius tuning slides and Kanstul ZKF 1525 - both in lacquer). Anxiously awaiting the call from Clayton at HiHorns letting me know that they're on their way!!

I will take all these pointers to heart.

Cheers!
Shermy

bandman

Hi Shermy,

I agree 100% with the gig/rehearsal concept of trying out horns. I like to play them under normal playing conditions to get an idea. I also hat eplaying a horn in front of some sales person standing there. That's why for me a convention is never a good place to try new horns.

I also like you 7-10 day trial period, but see if that can be extended if you are not positive about your new horns. My favorite horn inmy bag today was a bear to handle for the first few days/weeks I had it. It was just different from anything I had ever owned and I had to learn to adjust to the horn.

By the way -- you made a great choice of horns! I'm sure you will love that 1525! I've had mine now for a couple of years and it just keeps getting better! I've played the 1601 and liked it, but did not have it for long enough to form a valid opinion. I will say that right now if I was buying a horn it would be an Eclipse, but if it was not an Eclipse another Kanstul would find a new home in my bag.

trumpetdiva1

When I picked out my last trumpet which happened to be used, I tried it on three separate dates. It kept coming back to me and so after trying it next to mine, I bought it. I also brought it into a lesson to see what my trumpet teacher thought. If you can bring your teacher in with you or take it to a lesson, that would be good. I will not buy it if the sound is too stuffy or it restricts me in a particular register. I used to be into branding, but I found something that was off from my usual brand and found a great trumpet that way.

I cannot remember where I got this list for it is not mine, but if you know please tell me so that I can give them the proper credit. Maybe is it from Vincent Bach. Here it is:

1. Try open notes – can high notes by humored?
2. Intonation: Overall intonation; check D and E-flat (too flat?); check F and G-flat (too sharp), check low E-flat and A-flat
3. Pull tuning slide out an equal distance
4. Fit mouthpiece in snuggly
5. Play scales, octaves
6. Check dynamics-piano and forte
7. Low register–too tight, muddy, or closed?
8. Fatigued
9. Try as many of the same instruments as possible
10. Any air leaks?
11. Live quality to sound
12. Feel good in hands
13. Resistance
14. Sound too dark or too bright?
15. Is it an all-around trumpet? Can you play it in multiple bands (wind ensemble, quintet, and jazz band?
16. Overall impression


Janell

regularsopguy

all good advice! and i'd like to add that some "expensive" horns might not live up to some of those expectations, while some "cheap" horns might. keep an open mind and good luck!