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Vintage Trumpets / Cornets Discuss Cutting the 3rd slide on my Conn 40B in the Equipment forums; I have decided I want to use my 40B as my main axe for rock and funk gigs. But the ...
  1. #1
    Forte User mike ansberry's Avatar
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    Cutting the 3rd slide on my Conn 40B

    I have decided I want to use my 40B as my main axe for rock and funk gigs. But the 3rd valve slide is too long and causes tuning problems. I think back in this era the 3rd slide was made long on purpose to help get the D and C# better in tune, even though it is a kicker slide. I have to push the horn above the center of pitch to get it in tune on notes that use the 2 and 3 combination, and using 3 as an alternate fingering is right out. Any ideas on how much I should cut? I figure I'll take a little off at a time and solder it back together and play it a bit and then take a little more off if necessary.

    I'll be making the 1st slide into a kicker as well.
    "Music is a fire in your belly that has to come out of your mouth, so you'd better put a horn in the way before someone gets hurt"
    1949/50 Super Recording
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  2. #2
    Fortissimo User trumpetsplus's Avatar
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    Re: Cutting the 3rd slide on my Conn 40B

    Using a tuner, play the note you want to be in tune with your 3rd valve and see how flat it is (in cents - hundredths of a semitone). Then push the slide out to make it flatter. See how much flatter it is with what distance you have moved the slide and use that as a ratio as to how much to shorten the slide. Yes, I know that this gets us into the percentage plus not equalling the percentage minus stuff, but it will give you a good idea.
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  3. #3
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    Re: Cutting the 3rd slide on my Conn 40B

    I would consult a tech on this, I play on 4 horns, only one is "modern" in having a pullable third slide, and the other three are traditional with no movable slide (with ring) on the third valve slide.

    One of the traditional is a conn. I have compared all four third valve slides for this extra length that many say exists on the older instruments. I cant detect it on any instrument I have measured.

    I dont say it is mythical, however it should at least be apparrent but im jiggered if I can see any extra length.

    So based on my examinations, cut 0 off.

    I really think a tech should advise you, you cant add any back once its cut off. The tech should be able to tell you how much to cut off and maybe even do it for you.

    Could you not compare your 40b with your bach 37, the bach has a modern "short" slide with pull ring, and the conn 40b has the "longer" slide you want to shorten, both instruments are in Bb so they are otherwise identical, if the conn needs the same length of tubing on the third slide that the bach has, you should be able to measure it directly to see the extra length and make the 2 instruments the same. If you cant see any extra length on the conn third slide, all bets are off.
    Dennis78 likes this.
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  4. #4
    Forte User mike ansberry's Avatar
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    Re: Cutting the 3rd slide on my Conn 40B

    Actually, I am the tech who will do the work. I cut a small piece off the lead pipe on my Eclipse to make it better in tune. Leigh advised me about where to cut and how much to cut.
    "Music is a fire in your belly that has to come out of your mouth, so you'd better put a horn in the way before someone gets hurt"
    1949/50 Super Recording
    1949 Martin Committee
    1947 Olds Super
    Olds Super/Ultrasonic trumpet
    Olds Recording trumpet
    Olds Mendez
    Olds L-12
    Conn 40B
    Eclipse MR scratch gold
    Bach 37
    Scherzer Picc
    Buescher Mdl 15 Cornet in Bb/C/A (Dad's old horn)
    Boston 3 Star Ne Plus Ultra
    Natural trumpet hand made by my friend Howard Scudder

  5. #5
    Forte User mike ansberry's Avatar
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    Re: Cutting the 3rd slide on my Conn 40B

    Thanks for the advice, Ivan. What you say makes good sense.
    "Music is a fire in your belly that has to come out of your mouth, so you'd better put a horn in the way before someone gets hurt"
    1949/50 Super Recording
    1949 Martin Committee
    1947 Olds Super
    Olds Super/Ultrasonic trumpet
    Olds Recording trumpet
    Olds Mendez
    Olds L-12
    Conn 40B
    Eclipse MR scratch gold
    Bach 37
    Scherzer Picc
    Buescher Mdl 15 Cornet in Bb/C/A (Dad's old horn)
    Boston 3 Star Ne Plus Ultra
    Natural trumpet hand made by my friend Howard Scudder

  6. #6
    Mezzo Piano User
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    Re: Cutting the 3rd slide on my Conn 40B

    Thats cool, im glad your an experienced guy, I wonder if maybe you might like to consider making a frankenhorn and popping a modern third valve slide on the instrument, that gives you the modern tuning option, does that make sense, it sounds like you would be up to the job.
    If you can play Jazz you can Razzamatazz, But if you can play sweet you can always eat.

    Conn 80A Cornet May 1952
    Boosey and Hawkes Emperor Trumpet September 1955
    Selmer Student Trumpet September 1943
    Comet Pea shooter Trumpet Unknown build date probably 1950

  7. #7
    Forte User mike ansberry's Avatar
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    Re: Cutting the 3rd slide on my Conn 40B

    Actually, the 3rd valve slide is already set up as a kicker slide. Just too long. I will be turning the top part of the 1st valve slide around to add a first valve kicker as well.
    "Music is a fire in your belly that has to come out of your mouth, so you'd better put a horn in the way before someone gets hurt"
    1949/50 Super Recording
    1949 Martin Committee
    1947 Olds Super
    Olds Super/Ultrasonic trumpet
    Olds Recording trumpet
    Olds Mendez
    Olds L-12
    Conn 40B
    Eclipse MR scratch gold
    Bach 37
    Scherzer Picc
    Buescher Mdl 15 Cornet in Bb/C/A (Dad's old horn)
    Boston 3 Star Ne Plus Ultra
    Natural trumpet hand made by my friend Howard Scudder

  8. #8
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    Re: Cutting the 3rd slide on my Conn 40B

    Quote Originally Posted by trumpetsplus View Post
    ...I know that this gets us into the percentage plus not equalling the percentage minus stuff, but it will give you a good idea.
    Or, use your main tuning slide and bring it in the necessary amount to fix your note. And that's the amount right there.

  9. #9
    Piano User Pascalouisiana's Avatar
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    Re: Cutting the 3rd slide on my Conn 40B

    Here something else: I have noticed that the intonation's accuracy of an instrument is linked to the mouthpiece used. (Depth and length)
    I know that I don't directly answer your question and actually question your question, but your issue might not be a problem with the trumpet itself but with your mouthpiece.
    Just my $0.02
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  10. #10
    Forte User nieuwguyski's Avatar
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    Re: Cutting the 3rd slide on my Conn 40B

    Quote Originally Posted by mike ansberry View Post
    I figure I'll take a little off at a time and solder it back together and play it a bit and then take a little more off if necessary.
    Why would you unsolder anything? Can't you just cut off a bit of both male and female slides and shorten the overall length? What's in the way -- the ring mount?
    Dennis78 and True Tone like this.
    J. Notso Nieuwguyski

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