Hurray for first vintage horn! - Page 3

study888 · 07-19-2009, 02:11 AM

Hello MFan, I have a 1948 all brass H.N. White King Master Cornet. These Brass ones play just fine. If all of the laquer is gone,you can soak the Horn disassembled in a tub of hot warm water. Enough to cover Horn etc. Add 8oz. of TKO natural orange cleaner and 8Oz. of Simply Green. If you feel it may be to strong,use 4 oz. of each. Let all parts get a good soak,clean inside and outside, and all other parts with this solution. Rinse and then start over with a basic brand of lemon dish washing cleaning product. Take all parts you are going to polish,dry them and polish with the Flitz polish. It is the very best of all the polishers. I use it to clean the tarnish off the inner slides,but not the inside of valve casings. Make sure to clean Horn third time with lemon dish wash soap etc., before reassembling to get any flitz off threads,inner slides etc. Flitz even has two grades of its polish with a preserver polish.It will keep this Cornet looking good. These wrap around Cornets are easy to hold and well balanced. The Stork Vacchiano long shank Cornet m.p. in your prefered size, with pumped cup and D Symphonic back bore, play real nice on these Cornets. The Bach 7C,Bach 5B and the 4C or 4B Sparx play very well also. If your valves are in great shape,these Cornets are keepers,I use ALisyn valve oil on mine. If you need springs,the small Bach cornet springs will work. Band room1 may have a kit for it,they are easy to work on. I like the micro tuner feature it has,with the extra inner slide pulls for tuning. You both let us know how you like your King Master cornets,when you get them back in good playing conditon. Good luck.

MFfan · 07-19-2009, 09:10 AM

Thanks Study888 for the great info from a brass Master owner. I only have one of those, thinking it was silver first. It looks raw brass. I have stripped a couple of other horns, my 8-10 Besson , which had awful tarnish also, and others, but this one is a tough nut to crack so far. I have part of the bell pipe cleaned off. The valves seem like new and it has good springs. I haven't had to add any oil and was going to clean it up first. I'll try your method. I have used "the works" and CLR in the tub with other horns. I have some Bach MP's of the type you mentioned and will try them out. Like the way the cornet responds and the tone in all registers. This one must have been setting around for a long time. I don't have the special case, but usually carry whatever cornet I use , mostly in the Swing band, in my triple, with a trumpet, so that is not a problem.

I do like the wrap for comfort. I player OLDLOU's master some time ago , so had some knowledge of them. I'll try and post some pics later.

veery715 · 07-19-2009, 09:59 AM

The CLR bath is good for cleaning interior build-up or corrosion. It shouldn't be necessary for the outside. MASS metal polish works well on all kinds of metal.

v

MFfan · 07-19-2009, 03:51 PM

Thanks Veery, I would like to get the outside tarnish, which seems to really have a baked-on look. I have been able to remove some with MAAS, Silver polish , All metal polish, Brasso, etc, but nothing really attacks the tarnish very well to break down the composition. Here are photos of the horn and the weird Gretsch 34 all range mp that was with it, not intended for use by me.

46 King Master Model cornet w/Gretsch MP - a set on Flickr

Sungman · 07-19-2009, 06:25 PM

Your horn looks great to me! Hope it sounds great, and that you love it as much as I love mine.
That mouthpiece kind of interesting, I've never seen heard of gretsch, and the rims look a little like my parduba but i get the feeling the high point of the rim in on the inside

MFfan · 07-19-2009, 07:24 PM

Thanks Sungman. It does sound great now, even thought cosmetics are not too good yet. Will give it a good clean out this week. I tried the 7c on it and it does play well, as was suggested. That is my most usual size anyway, using a vintage OLDS 7c on my trumpets most time.

oldlou · 07-20-2009, 01:53 PM

What you call corosion on your recently acquired,( stolen ), King cornet looks to me to be old lacquer. Try Aircraft clean strip lacquer remover from your local Napa auto parts store. After the end of the month I am free until the Macinaw Bridge Walk on the labor Day weekend and a concert on the Grand Haven Water Front on the 4th of Sept. . Lets get together for a comparison of underslung cornets.

OLDLOU>>

MFfan · 07-20-2009, 05:36 PM

Ok, Lou, sounds good! The horn plays well, beautiful sound. I don't think I need to mess with the leaderpipe now, as there doesn't feel to be any air restriction.I cleaned out with bath soak in light dish soap and stuff came out and I finished the job with my cleaning kit, cleaning the slides (not much needed) and the reliable bag balm. I bought some zip strip at Meijer's , and with that and some soap sos pads, more is coming off. I'll see how much progress I get before putting any more money in cleaning stripping/polishing stuff. A little lacquer slid off on parts of the bell and slides after the stripper. Oh well, I have lots of time.

Looking forward to playing it in swing band next Monday. ( no rehearsal tonite) I have some neighbors that seem to like my playing.

Sungman · 07-20-2009, 08:34 PM

Hmm, I just got a a parduba cornet mouthpiece for this thing and the mouthpiece won't go in all the way.

Is there something different about the cornet's reciever that won't let it use modern mouthpieces?

p.s. uploaded pics again to album

study888 · 07-20-2009, 08:45 PM

Hello MFfan. You have the exact same model.engraving etc. King Master Cornet I have. Ole Lou is right,that is just old laquer on the Cornet. Be careful,to much hard rubbing can scratch the metal. 16oz. of the T.K.O.orange cleaning solution should melt that laquer right off this Cornet. Ole Lou is I believe also a Music Tech. You may want to try the solvent,if you can get all those dents removed I would do so. Correcting that dent on the lead pipe should greatly improve the sound. Play Lou's 36A Concert Grand if you get the chance.It is Conn's larger, nicer and improved version of the Reynolds and King Master Cornet wrap design. Some of the first Reyonlds Cornets look just like the King Master cornet. There is one or more shown in the Reynolds Contempora Trumpet/Cornet site. I was going to remove the old laquer off mine,since there are some small wear places. But just decided to polish the places where there is no laquer,it plays fine,leaving well enough alone. I am not into polishing Horns no more than I have to,keeping them clean on the inside is my main concern. It is my ugly duckling,that plays like a Sweet singing Canary.HaHa I did have a very nice,played very little,1950's King Liberty Balance Trumpet that was idential in engraving and extra fancy features like these King Master Cornets. I have two more of the model#2 King Liberty Trumpets,truck tore up,had to sell off the Liberty Balance and Super-20 to pay for the repairs. Life of the retired,up one day,down the next. But thank God,I am still hanging in there. Looking forward to seeing how Sungman"s Cornet turns out as well. Until

07-19-2009, 02:11 AM	#21
study888 Pianissimo User Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Darlington S.C. Posts: 153	Re: Hurray for first vintage horn! Hello MFan, I have a 1948 all brass H.N. White King Master Cornet. These Brass ones play just fine. If all of the laquer is gone,you can soak the Horn disassembled in a tub of hot warm water. Enough to cover Horn etc. Add 8oz. of TKO natural orange cleaner and 8Oz. of Simply Green. If you feel it may be to strong,use 4 oz. of each. Let all parts get a good soak,clean inside and outside, and all other parts with this solution. Rinse and then start over with a basic brand of lemon dish washing cleaning product. Take all parts you are going to polish,dry them and polish with the Flitz polish. It is the very best of all the polishers. I use it to clean the tarnish off the inner slides,but not the inside of valve casings. Make sure to clean Horn third time with lemon dish wash soap etc., before reassembling to get any flitz off threads,inner slides etc. Flitz even has two grades of its polish with a preserver polish.It will keep this Cornet looking good. These wrap around Cornets are easy to hold and well balanced. The Stork Vacchiano long shank Cornet m.p. in your prefered size, with pumped cup and D Symphonic back bore, play real nice on these Cornets. The Bach 7C,Bach 5B and the 4C or 4B Sparx play very well also. If your valves are in great shape,these Cornets are keepers,I use ALisyn valve oil on mine. If you need springs,the small Bach cornet springs will work. Band room1 may have a kit for it,they are easy to work on. I like the micro tuner feature it has,with the extra inner slide pulls for tuning. You both let us know how you like your King Master cornets,when you get them back in good playing conditon. Good luck.

07-19-2009, 09:10 AM	#22
MFfan Forte User Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Kalamazoo, Michigan Posts: 1,690	Re: Hurray for first vintage horn! Thanks Study888 for the great info from a brass Master owner. I only have one of those, thinking it was silver first. It looks raw brass. I have stripped a couple of other horns, my 8-10 Besson , which had awful tarnish also, and others, but this one is a tough nut to crack so far. I have part of the bell pipe cleaned off. The valves seem like new and it has good springs. I haven't had to add any oil and was going to clean it up first. I'll try your method. I have used "the works" and CLR in the tub with other horns. I have some Bach MP's of the type you mentioned and will try them out. Like the way the cornet responds and the tone in all registers. This one must have been setting around for a long time. I don't have the special case, but usually carry whatever cornet I use , mostly in the Swing band, in my triple, with a trumpet, so that is not a problem. I do like the wrap for comfort. I player OLDLOU's master some time ago , so had some knowledge of them. I'll try and post some pics later. __________________ Dave Rafferty Lemar Trumpet (peashooter-Conn?) Lyrical Trumpet (Tokan) Besson 609 Trumpet 1955-60 Besson 8-10 Trumpet 1948 Besson cornet 1946 King Master Cornet www.kalamazooconcertband.org

07-19-2009, 09:59 AM	#23
veery715 Forte User Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Ithaca NY Posts: 1,433	Re: Hurray for first vintage horn! The CLR bath is good for cleaning interior build-up or corrosion. It shouldn't be necessary for the outside. MASS metal polish works well on all kinds of metal. v

07-19-2009, 03:51 PM	#24
MFfan Forte User Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Kalamazoo, Michigan Posts: 1,690	Re: Hurray for first vintage horn! Thanks Veery, I would like to get the outside tarnish, which seems to really have a baked-on look. I have been able to remove some with MAAS, Silver polish , All metal polish, Brasso, etc, but nothing really attacks the tarnish very well to break down the composition. Here are photos of the horn and the weird Gretsch 34 all range mp that was with it, not intended for use by me. 46 King Master Model cornet w/Gretsch MP - a set on Flickr __________________ Dave Rafferty Lemar Trumpet (peashooter-Conn?) Lyrical Trumpet (Tokan) Besson 609 Trumpet 1955-60 Besson 8-10 Trumpet 1948 Besson cornet 1946 King Master Cornet www.kalamazooconcertband.org

07-19-2009, 06:25 PM	#25
Sungman Pianissimo User Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Delaware Posts: 139	Re: Hurray for first vintage horn! Your horn looks great to me! Hope it sounds great, and that you love it as much as I love mine. That mouthpiece kind of interesting, I've never seen heard of gretsch, and the rims look a little like my parduba but i get the feeling the high point of the rim in on the inside __________________ Benge 90b-SP - bach 1-1/2c 1920's King Master Cornet - HN. King Co. 36

07-19-2009, 07:24 PM	#26
MFfan Forte User Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Kalamazoo, Michigan Posts: 1,690	Re: Hurray for first vintage horn! Thanks Sungman. It does sound great now, even thought cosmetics are not too good yet. Will give it a good clean out this week. I tried the 7c on it and it does play well, as was suggested. That is my most usual size anyway, using a vintage OLDS 7c on my trumpets most time. __________________ Dave Rafferty Lemar Trumpet (peashooter-Conn?) Lyrical Trumpet (Tokan) Besson 609 Trumpet 1955-60 Besson 8-10 Trumpet 1948 Besson cornet 1946 King Master Cornet www.kalamazooconcertband.org

07-20-2009, 01:53 PM	#27
oldlou Forte User Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Grand Rapids, Mi. Posts: 1,242	Re: Hurray for first vintage horn! What you call corosion on your recently acquired,( stolen ), King cornet looks to me to be old lacquer. Try Aircraft clean strip lacquer remover from your local Napa auto parts store. After the end of the month I am free until the Macinaw Bridge Walk on the labor Day weekend and a concert on the Grand Haven Water Front on the 4th of Sept. . Lets get together for a comparison of underslung cornets. OLDLOU>> __________________ Couturier trumpet York Master Model trumpet York Elite trumpet York Airflow cornet King super 20 Master Model cornet King Liberty trumpet Reynolds Professional cornet Bohm & Meinl professional trumpet Besson 10-10 trumpet with Holton M.F. bell Olds Special cornet Los Angeles B&H Sovereign cornet G.R.Band Instr. cornet Getzen Super Deluxe trumpet and cornet Getzen Deluxe trumpet and cornet Many others no room to list

07-20-2009, 05:36 PM	#28
MFfan Forte User Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Kalamazoo, Michigan Posts: 1,690	Re: Hurray for first vintage horn! Ok, Lou, sounds good! The horn plays well, beautiful sound. I don't think I need to mess with the leaderpipe now, as there doesn't feel to be any air restriction.I cleaned out with bath soak in light dish soap and stuff came out and I finished the job with my cleaning kit, cleaning the slides (not much needed) and the reliable bag balm. I bought some zip strip at Meijer's , and with that and some soap sos pads, more is coming off. I'll see how much progress I get before putting any more money in cleaning stripping/polishing stuff. A little lacquer slid off on parts of the bell and slides after the stripper. Oh well, I have lots of time. Looking forward to playing it in swing band next Monday. ( no rehearsal tonite) I have some neighbors that seem to like my playing. __________________ Dave Rafferty Lemar Trumpet (peashooter-Conn?) Lyrical Trumpet (Tokan) Besson 609 Trumpet 1955-60 Besson 8-10 Trumpet 1948 Besson cornet 1946 King Master Cornet www.kalamazooconcertband.org

07-20-2009, 08:34 PM	#29
Sungman Pianissimo User Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Delaware Posts: 139	Re: Hurray for first vintage horn! Hmm, I just got a a parduba cornet mouthpiece for this thing and the mouthpiece won't go in all the way. Is there something different about the cornet's reciever that won't let it use modern mouthpieces? p.s. uploaded pics again to album __________________ Benge 90b-SP - bach 1-1/2c 1920's King Master Cornet - HN. King Co. 36 Last edited by Sungman; 07-20-2009 at 09:04 PM.

07-20-2009, 08:45 PM	#30
study888 Pianissimo User Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Darlington S.C. Posts: 153	Re: Hurray for first vintage horn! Hello MFfan. You have the exact same model.engraving etc. King Master Cornet I have. Ole Lou is right,that is just old laquer on the Cornet. Be careful,to much hard rubbing can scratch the metal. 16oz. of the T.K.O.orange cleaning solution should melt that laquer right off this Cornet. Ole Lou is I believe also a Music Tech. You may want to try the solvent,if you can get all those dents removed I would do so. Correcting that dent on the lead pipe should greatly improve the sound. Play Lou's 36A Concert Grand if you get the chance.It is Conn's larger, nicer and improved version of the Reynolds and King Master Cornet wrap design. Some of the first Reyonlds Cornets look just like the King Master cornet. There is one or more shown in the Reynolds Contempora Trumpet/Cornet site. I was going to remove the old laquer off mine,since there are some small wear places. But just decided to polish the places where there is no laquer,it plays fine,leaving well enough alone. I am not into polishing Horns no more than I have to,keeping them clean on the inside is my main concern. It is my ugly duckling,that plays like a Sweet singing Canary.HaHa I did have a very nice,played very little,1950's King Liberty Balance Trumpet that was idential in engraving and extra fancy features like these King Master Cornets. I have two more of the model#2 King Liberty Trumpets,truck tore up,had to sell off the Liberty Balance and Super-20 to pay for the repairs. Life of the retired,up one day,down the next. But thank God,I am still hanging in there. Looking forward to seeing how Sungman"s Cornet turns out as well. Until Last edited by study888; 07-20-2009 at 08:46 PM. Reason: word correction

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