ViperAT14

Hi everyone, I recently started playing the trumpet and I came upon a trumpet in a garage sale. It has King Super 20 engraved in it. It came in a chicago boys club case. I tried searching the internet for information on this trumpet but i can't seem to find any info. Could anyone please give me some links on King super 20 trumpets, or maybe somewhere i could find its age. Any help would be greatly appreciated!

Solar Bell

Welcome to TrumpetMaster!!

Here is the Vintage King site:

www.hnwhitekings.com/index.html

and here is the Super 20 page.

www.hnwhitekings.com/super20.html

A GREAT trumpet, my dad played one for a long time, and I started on a Super 20 model 1047 with the tuning slide lock.

-cw-

ViperAT14

Thanks for the information it was helpful. Now i am trying to find out if the one i have is a model 1047 or 1048. Also I was talking with someone about this trumpet I just bought and he immediatly started to make me offers on it. The way he came on so quickly i assumed that it might be worth something. I plan on keeping it for personal use but i am just wondering about how much they are worth. Does anyone know any websites that will help me find out what its worth?

Solar Bell

Hey Snake,

Go to the forum index, see wher4e it says Vintage trumpets/ Cornets.

Ubder that is the name Tom Turner. Double ckick on his name and send him a PM.

Also give this guy an email, he KNOWS King horns, kingtrumpetguy@hnwhitekings.com;
-cw-

dcstep

What does it say on the bell and the 2d valve casing?

Dave

ViperAT14

On the bell it says king super 20, and on the second valve casing 358017

dcstep

So no "DB" "Dual Bore" or "Silver Sonic" or "Symphony". As to whether it's a 1047 or 1048, I don't know now, but I'll consult my old catalog tonight to see if there are any hints to be had there.

Dave

tom turner

Hi,

[NOTE: Rather than respond to your PM, I decided to post publically, for the benefit (possibly) of others who have the same questions.

This is my usual method, for my free time is short, and the time I put into my answers is consuming . . . so I might as well try to help others at the same time!]

If you can post some images of the trumpet it will help in the identification of it and help you get a decent idea of what it might be worth.

The Super 20 was a really nice trumpet during the glory days of the H.N. White Company. Unfortunately, people think of the word "King," when they really should be thinking "H.N. White."

Henderson White founded his company in 1893, and his "meal ticket" got punched for success when he worked with trombone player he knew that played in a theatre orchestra named Thomas King, to develop a decent trombone.

Thus, H.N. White's "King" model trombone was created and became a huge success. His other musical instruments at the time were not as highly regarded but H.N. White ALWAYS worked hard at developing his models.

The "King" trombone success eventually spread to other instruments. Foster Reynolds, trained by the York brothers, joined the White company in 1904 . . . and started putting the high brass H.N. White instruments on the map too!

Since people liked their "King" model H.N. White trombones, White started calling his other instruments "King" models too! Mr. White died in 1940, and by that time he had a "stable" of famous artists playing his horns. White REALLY went after the top artists and worked very hard to make instruments that those guys would love and endorse. His wife Edna continued leadership of the company until '65 when it was bought out by Norlin . . .

The company became called the King company. How ironic that this great man would be less known to folks than an obscure trombone player of the very late 19th century.


YOUR SUPER 20 . . .

Was made in the mid-1950s, when King horns were still very highly regarded, and the Super 20 was a great horn in their line-up. There were different bore sizes, and the larger sizes are probably more desired today than the small bore horns . . . if for no other reason than this is the trend on all trumpets played by modern players.

HOW MUCH IS IT WORTH?

There's no way to tell without a hands on test by a competent instrument repair/trumpeter who isn't trying to beat you out of it!!!

IF . . .

If the horn was NEVER dropped and damaged, there's less chance it has "stress" problems that can kill the response of a horn.

If the horn's valve compression is still really good, there's a good chance it will play well . . . after a chem-clean, replacement of valve corks and a brand new valve alignment.

If the finish is in great shape, it is worth much more than a "beater" with little, or no lacquer or silver remaining.

If the case is missing it hurts the value. Even a really worn out case does too, for it shows the horn was carried and used a whole lot (sort of like a car with very high miles on the speedometer)

IF . . . you can post some photos onto this thread, several folks can give you a much greater idea of it's POTENTIAL value.

In your PM, you told me what you paid for it. That person's offer for TWICE what you paid is a real insult.

I really hesitate to give you a better idea without seeing photos of the horn.


GOOD NEWS/BAD NEWS

The good news for you is that the "internet buzz" about the Olds horns (and the Reynolds horns) has not spread YET to the top King instruments . . . even though a good, top model King could be just as fine. SO . . . someone buying a really nice King TOP MODEL will usually get a GREAT PRICE!!!

The bad news is that it's resale value to YOU at this point is on the low side of a nice Olds or Reynolds.

I'd hang on to the horn for now. You may have a gem of a horn that could make you "forget" a brand new pro model horn. I read you are a new trumpet player so there's no way yet that you have the chops and experience to truly evaluate the horn.

Beware of folks who offer you fast cash, they are generally not thinking of YOUR best interests!

TWO RECOMMENDATIONS . . .

1. Hang around this website, and on this vintage horns forum, and visit/lurk often. You'll really start learning what's happening fairly fast.

2. Visit the H.N. White tribute website listed below that's dedicated to the REAL "King" trumpets of H. N. White! You'll learn a lot there. Also, the website's owner is a great fellow who will help you a lot!!!

Hope this helps!

Tom

Robert Rowe

Just a follow-up ....

I have a few of the Super-20s, including the vaunted "Symphony Silversonic", Dual-Bore.

I follow the online auctions (to some extent, time permitting), generally, to establish values of horns I wish to insure for stated-value, or to entertain interesting trades/sales.

Anyone wishing to determine value may contact me ("PM").

Someday, we're gonna provide a "certified-appraisal" service for those in need. Will not be free.

Robt
__________________________________________________ ____________________
"The best thing you can do for the poor ... is not be one of them!" -- The Reverend Ike (early radio & TV evangelist)

Berney

Hi
I have had my King Super 20 (1047) for 32 years since my dad bought it for me in 1974. However, it is #472631 which (from what I have read) puts its manufacture around 1971. It shows an S1 on the second valve, which seems to mean it is a small bore. It is in mint condition with the exception of one ding in the bell. (I left it unlocked in the band room one day in grade 8 when TODD WHITTAKER decided he would love to give it a try. After messing up a few bars he promptly let it down atop one of those old music stands. The folding type with alot of pointy bits sticking up. Grr...perhaps another 25 years might erase that one from my memory, but I doubt it.)

Anyway, thought you might like to have a look at the 1047. Please excuse my photography...that is if I can even get them to post! Here goes...

Cheers

Berney

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