Embouchure Classification

Raw_Brass_Kicks · 08-21-2009, 07:11 PM

I have been doing a lot of embouchure study and have tried to understand reindhart's pivot system. his ideas make sense and all, but i don't think any of it can apply to me until i actually know what embouchure type i am! I'm not sure there are any pivot teachers in my area. is there a way to self analyze my embouchure so i can recognize what i'm doing wrong and how to fix it?
Thanks,
RBK

rowuk · 08-23-2009, 12:54 PM

RBK,
if an embouchure works, it is good. If not, it is probably not the embouchure rather body use and breathing!

Self analysis of the embouchure only works when you have an extemely good working knowledge of how things work. By then, you don't need to change the embouchure.

Embouchure is not like buying tires for your car. Some for winter, some for summer, some all-weather. Changing embouchures is like trying to quit smoking - plenty of stuff to make your life VERY miserable - and no guarantee that you will not get cancer from past sins.

In over 30 years of teaching, I have only had 3 embouchure changes - and those only after all other resources were exhausted.

The top reasons for miserable range, sound and endurance are body use and breathing, not embouchure. I recommend not messing with your chops. You have no idea what you are getting into. Get your breathing and body use together. Much lower risk of messing yourself up!

Raw_Brass_Kicks · 08-24-2009, 01:11 AM

i am not necessarily suggesting a complete embouchure change. i am referring to improvement upon it, like more efficient buzz, focused buzz, jaw angle etc. when you refer to body use and breathing improvements, what kinds of practice can improve those?

wiseone2 · 08-24-2009, 08:59 AM

How do you sound? Do you have air leaks? Range problems? Endurance issues? What are your musical issues?
Wilmer

Raw_Brass_Kicks · 08-24-2009, 08:51 PM

most of my problems are inconsistency in range (sometimes a high c one day, sometimes a high f), poor breath attacks, knowing how to pucker, playing two different mouthpiece types (bobby shew #2 and 5c) and tonguing against my lips.

wiseone2 · 08-25-2009, 10:22 AM

Go to basics.
If your foundation is firm you will NEVER have the problems you describe. Careful work on fundamental skills is usually the cure for any and all trumpet problems.
Go slow.
Wilmer

Raw_Brass_Kicks · 08-25-2009, 01:48 PM

what would be a fundamental way to improve breathing and tongue attacks?

wiseone2 · 08-25-2009, 02:04 PM

I believe in a rhythmic approach to initial attacks.
I breathe on the upbeat of four........1,2,3,4 breath. Try this on middle G. Play pianissimo. Hold for 4 counts. That's the secret to attack......Rhythm!
Wilmer

wiseone2 · 08-25-2009, 03:05 PM

Fundamentals-
Go to page 125 in the Arban book, play it....... if you can't, you need to take a step back and work on this.
The section on dotted rhythms, the scales section of the Arban book will do wonders for your overall playing.
I get the sense that these things are neglected by players. High notes will come later

Wilmer

Raw_Brass_Kicks · 08-27-2009, 10:08 PM

wow that page 125 is really helpful!

08-21-2009, 07:11 PM	#1
Raw_Brass_Kicks New Friend Join Date: Aug 2009 Posts: 17	Embouchure Classification I have been doing a lot of embouchure study and have tried to understand reindhart's pivot system. his ideas make sense and all, but i don't think any of it can apply to me until i actually know what embouchure type i am! I'm not sure there are any pivot teachers in my area. is there a way to self analyze my embouchure so i can recognize what i'm doing wrong and how to fix it? Thanks, RBK

08-24-2009, 01:11 AM	#3
Raw_Brass_Kicks New Friend Join Date: Aug 2009 Posts: 17	Re: Embouchure Classification i am not necessarily suggesting a complete embouchure change. i am referring to improvement upon it, like more efficient buzz, focused buzz, jaw angle etc. when you refer to body use and breathing improvements, what kinds of practice can improve those?

08-24-2009, 08:59 AM	#4
wiseone2 Artitst in Residence Fortissimo User Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Brooklyn,NY Posts: 2,870	Re: Embouchure Classification How do you sound? Do you have air leaks? Range problems? Endurance issues? What are your musical issues? Wilmer __________________ Be sure Brain is engaged before putting Mouthpiece in gear. S.Suark 1951

08-24-2009, 08:51 PM	#5
Raw_Brass_Kicks New Friend Join Date: Aug 2009 Posts: 17	Re: Embouchure Classification most of my problems are inconsistency in range (sometimes a high c one day, sometimes a high f), poor breath attacks, knowing how to pucker, playing two different mouthpiece types (bobby shew #2 and 5c) and tonguing against my lips. Last edited by Raw_Brass_Kicks; 08-24-2009 at 08:53 PM.

08-25-2009, 10:22 AM	#6
wiseone2 Artitst in Residence Fortissimo User Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Brooklyn,NY Posts: 2,870	Re: Embouchure Classification Go to basics. If your foundation is firm you will NEVER have the problems you describe. Careful work on fundamental skills is usually the cure for any and all trumpet problems. Go slow. Wilmer __________________ Be sure Brain is engaged before putting Mouthpiece in gear. S.Suark 1951

08-23-2009, 12:54 PM	#2
rowuk Moderator Utimate User Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Germany Posts: 7,355	Re: Embouchure Classification RBK, if an embouchure works, it is good. If not, it is probably not the embouchure rather body use and breathing! Self analysis of the embouchure only works when you have an extemely good working knowledge of how things work. By then, you don't need to change the embouchure. Embouchure is not like buying tires for your car. Some for winter, some for summer, some all-weather. Changing embouchures is like trying to quit smoking - plenty of stuff to make your life VERY miserable - and no guarantee that you will not get cancer from past sins. In over 30 years of teaching, I have only had 3 embouchure changes - and those only after all other resources were exhausted. The top reasons for miserable range, sound and endurance are body use and breathing, not embouchure. I recommend not messing with your chops. You have no idea what you are getting into. Get your breathing and body use together. Much lower risk of messing yourself up! __________________ Whenever I feel blue, I start breathing again.

08-25-2009, 01:48 PM	#7
Raw_Brass_Kicks New Friend Join Date: Aug 2009 Posts: 17	Re: Embouchure Classification what would be a fundamental way to improve breathing and tongue attacks?

08-25-2009, 02:04 PM	#8
wiseone2 Artitst in Residence Fortissimo User Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Brooklyn,NY Posts: 2,870	Re: Embouchure Classification I believe in a rhythmic approach to initial attacks. I breathe on the upbeat of four........1,2,3,4 breath. Try this on middle G. Play pianissimo. Hold for 4 counts. That's the secret to attack......Rhythm! Wilmer __________________ Be sure Brain is engaged before putting Mouthpiece in gear. S.Suark 1951

08-25-2009, 03:05 PM	#9
wiseone2 Artitst in Residence Fortissimo User Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Brooklyn,NY Posts: 2,870	Re: Embouchure Classification Fundamentals- Go to page 125 in the Arban book, play it....... if you can't, you need to take a step back and work on this. The section on dotted rhythms, the scales section of the Arban book will do wonders for your overall playing. I get the sense that these things are neglected by players. High notes will come later Wilmer __________________ Be sure Brain is engaged before putting Mouthpiece in gear. S.Suark 1951

08-27-2009, 10:08 PM	#10
Raw_Brass_Kicks New Friend Join Date: Aug 2009 Posts: 17	Re: Embouchure Classification wow that page 125 is really helpful!

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